Author Topic: rider's center of gravity  (Read 2173 times)

ptrshpt

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rider's center of gravity
« on: March 25, 2016, 04:50:58 PM »
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« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 12:56:37 PM by ptrshpt »

vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2016, 05:31:04 PM »
Please, can someone tell me if the rider's center of gravity it's in the same place for both images or it moves depending on rider's body position.
Cannot imagine it not moving.

BTW, women's CoG is quite a bit lower than men's, so it might be a bit different for them.
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Napalm Nick

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2016, 05:34:17 PM »
I should think the head going forward is counterbalanced by the ass going back, but I would think the CoG lowers a little overall. Depends how heavy your head or ass is of course.  Usually the perfect racer is a Weeble.
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Meyer#12

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2016, 07:03:52 PM »
I would say center of gravity moves a little, not much but i am sure it affects a little, why would riders otherwise move backwards, sideways and up and down on the bike to make it behave different in different situations? I at least used my body a lot when riding all the time trying to ride around the small problems that gets cured with setup, because you can't cure it 100% with setup, another problem will most of the time come

Just my thoughts on this, not a physics expert lol
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Napalm Nick

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2016, 09:11:14 PM »
I suspect that moving the CoG away from the rear wheel by moving the rider CoG forward is having a similar effect to extending the rear swingarm (also moving the swingarm away rom the CoG). I also have a modified Mura in my bike folder with pivot adjustments, a slight swingarm extension and some other tweaks that cures the wobble30 and is nice to ride.  However I don't dance about it because I think the changes have probably slipped outside the values of realism  ::)
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vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2016, 09:33:49 PM »
However I don't dance about it because I think the changes have probably slipped outside the values of realism  ::)
It's probably still a good idea to send those changes to PiBoSo so that he knows in which directions the physics/bike data tweaks have to go.

Oh and I would really like to try that wobbleless Mura :D
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Napalm Nick

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2016, 10:55:49 PM »
LoL I doubt he would want to see my 'pin the tail on the donkey' effort at all. Hehe!

I remember he suggested it might be just an easy damping tweak that was needed so I started there and gave up after a few hours of tweak and test and moved onto tweak and test on the geometry instead with a predictable result based on what was done, but unsatisfying because it was a fudge based on no real life readings. Anyway I will dig it out of storage tomorrow and send you a link.
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vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2016, 11:45:23 PM »
Found PiBoSo's comment on that:
Now, at last, everyone seems to be reasonably happy with the physics and all the planned features have been integrated.
Apart from the strong wobbles at 30 lean and too much grip at the rear (of the Mura) which leads to a lot of gearbox problems on downshifts (making braking very messy sometimes).
The wobbles only begin to show on the Mura when carrying low fuel (<5L).

Those problems can most likely be fixed with better data, specifically of the tyres and steer damper.
However, the gearbox simulation probably needs work.
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Klax75

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2016, 04:04:49 AM »
What I find most interesting about this thread is the two photos of Rossi. Who is on the taller side for a rider. But this still applies. With our rider, on some bikes if not most. Even when he is fully tucked in his arms are practically stiff armed straight ahead of him. Where in reality when your full tucked in your elbows are very bent and your arms hang down to you sides tucked in to your body unless making a turn. I really think the riders proportions need another look at.

vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2016, 09:23:14 AM »
I wonder what is the purpose of this middle forward lean for automatic f/b lean...
What do you mean?
I also wonder if the back and forth movement for automatic f/b lean has any effect on handling or is just visual...  It gives me motion sickness...
The automatic f/b lean is throttle dependent and it surely has an effect on handling.
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Klax75

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2016, 05:53:56 PM »
I do use manual rider lean, forward/back and left/right on the right thumb stick. So when I am riding that stick is constantly moving shifting the weight. If I need to get half tucked in I don't push the stick as much. To be honest the bug from previous beta's, where it would only tuck in fully at 90 mph was extremely annoying. Since at times the rider would sit up when I wanted him to stay down.

With DST there is far less wobbles then with the virtual rider, the downside it's super easy to dump the bike and fall over. Since the virtual rider isn't there to try and protect you from falling over.

vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2016, 07:31:12 PM »
With manual rider F/B lean, trying to achieve this middle position with a thumbstick it is very distracting.
I mean you could modify your controller to have multiple 'steps' or just assign l/r lean to the stick as well and you will see that this middle position problem will go away.
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vini97

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Re: rider's center of gravity
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2016, 04:29:54 PM »
Assigning l/r lean to the same stick as f/b lean you can't have both at the same time. I want to be able to keep the l/r lean while leaning forward.
I use the left stick of my controller for steering and the right for rider movement. f/b on the vertical axis, l/r on the horizontal axis.



Regarding the automatic rider lean...
When using manual rider lean should one gradually lean back and forward, right and left like the automatic movement to get the same handling effects...?!  :-\
Yes, be smooth and lean the rider depending on the bike lean angle instead of throttle input. Leaning the rider a bit more than necessary usually helps with stability. Automatic f/b lean could make that impossible, though.
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