Author Topic: Suspension simulation bug  (Read 137 times)

Stout Johnson

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Suspension simulation bug
« on: December 06, 2017, 06:20:02 PM »
Dear Piboso, glad to see you are working on WRS. Really looking forward to the new beta. Would be really glad if you could adress the suspension simulation bug (it's in there for a long time now, happens for all cars) before releasing the next beta. Would gladly offer to test if there is need.

Here is a video of the bug, towards the end.
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/ZyQxvHVXils" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/ZyQxvHVXils</a>
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PiBoSo

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2017, 06:25:40 PM »

This is a known limitation of the tyre model when sliding 90 degrees laterally.

Stout Johnson

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2017, 07:14:35 PM »

This is a known limitation of the tyre model when sliding 90 degrees laterally.
Ok. Just to make sure we talk about the same, I mean the weird "jumping" of the car before coming to a stand-still. Before the car comes to a stand-still, it moves back and forth even lateraly back to where it came from. Either way, is there a way of possibly fixing this? Does not look sim-like. Otherwise I am having a blast with the RX on Holjes.  :)

OT: Btw, Iracing unveiled its RX content, it does not get very good reviews. Might be a good point to showboat what you got ; ) Are there plans to include race format like this in the near future?
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/vYgcM2a65g0" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/vYgcM2a65g0</a>

Would probably get some attention with your physics, especially since netcode seems to be greatly improved (judging from KRP and MXB).

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PiBoSo

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2017, 11:00:58 PM »

This is a known limitation of the tyre model when sliding 90 degrees laterally.
Ok. Just to make sure we talk about the same, I mean the weird "jumping" of the car before coming to a stand-still. Before the car comes to a stand-still, it moves back and forth even lateraly back to where it came from. Either way, is there a way of possibly fixing this? Does not look sim-like. Otherwise I am having a blast with the RX on Holjes.  :)

The spring-like effect doesn't look good at all, but it's not really a problem for the simulation, because it only happens when the tyre is sliding 90 degrees, out of control, so not during normal driving conditions.

Stout Johnson

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2017, 07:04:09 AM »
The spring-like effect doesn't look good at all, but it's not really a problem for the simulation, because it only happens when the tyre is sliding 90 degrees, out of control, so not during normal driving conditions.
Ok thank you for the explanation. Overall the simulation feels really really good (especially since beta11). Good to know it only affects the simulation in extreme conditions. I like how the RX behaves with RX tyres on dirt and tarmac, overall really believable. I also like how the slicks behave on dirt, also very believable. Overall it feels great.

2 final thoughts/remarks:
  • You state that it only happens when the tyre slides 90 degree laterally. Depending on the track, in RX it is not uncommon to have 90 degree sliding angles for short periods, especially on the rear tyres. So in effect, it does affect to simulation to some degree. The fascination about RX especially is the driving in extreme slides and still having control adn essentially making one faster.
  • So the underlying tyre simulation model does have some limitations. With your knowledge and expertise, why not adjust the tyre model in a way that it is suitable even for extreme driving conditions? I know you probably want to stick to the current raw tyre simulation, as it is accepted. But if the underlying simulation does not take extreme driving conditions into account, then please fill this gap. It would actually be a surplus. It could be reality-checked just by having the car/tyres behave like in real life. You would still stick to the normal tyre model in "normal" driving situations. It would essentially only effect RX and then only for extreme slides. But again, those situations are important for RX.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2017, 07:13:21 AM by Stout Johnson »
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Phathry25

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 12:15:55 AM »
I believe the bug has to do with pure lateral slip.  Wheels locked, sliding sideways, at low speeds.  Not really an issue IMO.

PiBoSo

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Re: Suspension simulation bug
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2017, 01:08:25 AM »
Are there plans to include race format like this in the near future?

Of course there are plans to properly include heats and joker lap. As soon as possible.
Unfortunately time is never enough when working on multiple projects at the same time  :-[