Author Topic: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders  (Read 624 times)

Manu

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Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« on: March 15, 2018, 05:40:17 PM »
I would like a contact penalty system added in the next update of GP Bikes.

CBRP System (Contact Between Riders Penalty)

 That is, if the rider hits another rider, they receive a penalty. Depending on the speed or magnitude of the impact, the penalty will be higher. It would also be cumulative and at the sum of "x" impacts the rider is disqualified from the race.

For example:

1x - 1x/5x If one rider hits another
2x - 2x/5x If it collides again with another rider


And so on until you reach a limit of collisions (5x) whereby the rider would be disqualified from the race.

Edit: As there is no way for the game to know who hits first the sanction would be for both riders. It may seem unfair but iRacing uses this system and the online races are the cleanest I have ever seen.

« Last Edit: March 15, 2018, 11:59:07 PM by Manu »

doubledragoncc

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2018, 05:46:42 PM »
I have to say its wrong

I does not happen in real life..............that simple

Luv you Manu but bad idea and its not a nessecity

Netcode first please

DD

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guigui404

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2018, 06:57:51 PM »
Could be just implemented by ourself in championship , at the end we ask for replay and we watch , so we can manually do this

connorhall70

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2018, 08:20:05 PM »
Could be just implemented by ourself in championship , at the end we ask for replay and we watch , so we can manually do this


whole point is to take the manual part away...
GanjaGod

uberslug

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2018, 09:11:39 PM »
I have to say its wrong

I does not happen in real life..............that simple

Luv you Manu but bad idea and its not a nessecity

Netcode first please

DD

Uh, riders do get penalized IRL when they persistently bounce off of other riders.

While Manu has always passed me cleanly others are far less considerate. One rider who I affectionately refer to as 'AssHat' ran into me twice on back to back laps in the same event. In both cases Mr. AssHat had plenty of room to pass on the inside had they been paying attention and riding under control.

I kind of like the idea of automatic penalties: Bump into a rider and neither of you go down, small time penalty; Bump into a rider and they go down, larger time penalty.

The other thing I would like to see is representative time penalties for crashing on one's own based on speed. Low side at 50 kph and you can pop right back up with only a six to eight second price to pay [as it is now]. Crash at 250 kph and your day is done, period.

Napalm Nick

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2018, 09:24:46 PM »

Please don't let it be me  :'(

Hawk

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2018, 10:54:15 PM »
Good idea in theory Manu, but:
The problem with that would be in structuring the logic in the programming to accomplish this? How would programme logic determine consistently and without error who actually hit who? Did the collision come from the rider approaching another rider to overtake, or was it because the rider in front moved into the other riders line causing the collision?

If you've ever played FIM Speedway Grand Prix 15 then you'll know what I mean, it's terrible at defining who was to blame for collisions and often penalises the wrong riders.

But yeah, I think the programming logic for doing this would be a lot more complicated that it first appears.... could even be impossible to do it so that collision detection errors and the resultant rider fault decision are always the correct result.

uberslug

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2018, 11:03:16 PM »

Please don't let it be me  :'(

No, Mr. Napalm, it is not you.

matty0l215

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2018, 11:16:59 PM »
It would be nice for say an Admin on track to be able to add and retract penelties on the fly, Maybe have a icon to show if contact had been made and see if it warrents a penelty?

Just a thoght

A full and proper race control would also be nice  ;D

Manu

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2018, 11:45:02 PM »
As there is no way for the game to know who hits first the sanction would be for both riders. It may seem unfair but iRacing uses this system and the online races are the cleanest I have ever seen.

Vini

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2018, 05:51:18 AM »
imo, the rider attempting to overtake (so coming from behind) should be penalized.

Hawk

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2018, 07:50:05 AM »
imo, the rider attempting to overtake (so coming from behind) should be penalized.

But surely that could leave a situation where the overtaking rider is committed to their overtake action yet the rider in front cuts across(due to the line they take) resulting in a collision? Who would be to blame then? You surely cannot have a situation where the rider attempting an overtake manoeuvre is always to blame for a collision because that's not always the case. :)

Good riders who know their race-craft will hold their line through corners, just as an approaching rider will assess the rider in fronts line through a corner before attempting an overtake manoeuvre... From my experience in GPB events it's that later part of that race-craft and the timing of the overtake manoeuvre that a lot of riders, even good riders, in GPB seem to lack and thereby often causing a collision and crash because they go for a gap that is going to be closed by the rider in fronts different line through the corner.....

Maybe a lot of these collision/bike-crash issues could be resolved if the effect of collisions of the bikes were less severe? I'm talking here about the ability to push a rider aside(with reasonably light-ish contact) rather than that same collision resulting in a full blown bike crash? You can do this in reality quite easily without causing the opponent rider to crash, but there must always be the risk of causing a crash by making such a manoeuvre and for such a manoeuvre not to be Micky-mouse programmed to the extent that you can severely hit another rider without causing an accident like we see in other so called bike sims/games.

janaucarre

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2018, 09:36:12 AM »
Hi,
It's a bad idea i think.
Compare bikes to car is difficult in case of crash causes.
The reaction of a bike, when one coming on the left of another bike in a left corner, the rider at the exterior stop turning, and brakes, the reaction is really not the same as a car, i hope you see what i mean.
It's a bit complicated to implement a thing like that.
For many years i play gpb all riders are fairplay, except some who go in wrong sense to... I dont know for what.
If some hit other it is clearly not what he would, error, less experience than other.

uberslug

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2018, 11:20:08 AM »
imo, the rider attempting to overtake (so coming from behind) should be penalized.

But surely that could leave a situation where the overtaking rider is committed to their overtake action yet the rider in front cuts across(due to the line they take) resulting in a collision? Who would be to blame then? You surely cannot have a situation where the rider attempting an overtake manoeuvre is always to blame for a collision because that's not always the case. :)


IIRC, the rules stipulate rider in front has the right of way and the rider behind is responsible for not causing a collision. The reason 'block passes' are so effective is because once the passer has his wheel in front, the passee has to yield the right of way, even if it means going much slower and on a different line than their original intention. The issue we have here in no way resembles real life. On both occasions Mr. AssHat ran into me when I was allowing more than adequate room to pass on the inside. His ambition far outweighed his ability.

poumpouny

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Re: Penalty System: Contact Between Riders
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2018, 11:22:01 AM »
The best exemple is minorating, but it's implemented in the server side. Minorating is calculating penalties from many factor, so if you hit someone, the algoryth calculate if you had made mistakes before, or on the former race you have done (crossing pit exit line... had previous contact ,how much you've crashed) then it give you a proportionnal penalties, in the other hand, if you manage to give close race batle without contact, it reward you point etc ......

DD: of course there is contact penalties in real life, but there is no etablished rule, it just depend on the race direction descision. The best example is the contact between Rossi and marquez in the 2015's grand prix, nobody really manage to say who's kick who out but in the end, rossi was penalized to start last on the grid and then just lose the opportunity to win a 10th title, even if he managed to finish 4th !