Author Topic: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers  (Read 1844 times)

lluisete

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2018, 12:48:08 PM »
If u check a bit the content of this guy u have two main content:

1) Videos abount mainstream games like AssettoCorsa Competizione, Project Cars, F1 2018 ... So, this guy is looking for creating content that is mainstream in that moment to get tons of visits = money.

2) Reviews of products: If u check the links that this guy put in the descriptions all of them are refferals, that means that Fanatec and the other brand products are paying this guy for this review. More people visiting the web via the refferal link = more money = he create good content talking albout it.

3) All content of this guy have the objective of enterntain because If people see all video Youtube algoritm improves ur rating as youtuber, so he have to make entertaining content racing online, testing multiple tracks, showing something interesting, etc... KRP have not so much content and the most important, he will play alone, so It's kinda hard create entertaining content that makes people stay watching all video. (This point is the less important).

He just ignore the petition of the KRP because is not mainstream game and u are not paying him to do it, it's verysimple. It's not a conspiracy, it's just how world works.


3) The reputation of the developer. 90% of people that joins this community gets bored and left it because of the lack of updates. U get some new players but there is players who left the game too so game never grow. I continue talking with people who helped A LOT THIS GAME years ago and they all left because got bored waiting updates or had big discrepancies with you. I created a Twitter in 2012 who got more than 300 followers in less one year and left this game because had discrepances with you, that twitter could continue growing and making new players. U have a good guy like Jorge Sprinter making very good content about ur game and GIVING YOU a lot of clients (If u visit servers at nights the 80% of people is spanish and half of them discovered the game thanks to Jorge) and he have to BUY THE KEYS to make raffles meanwhile other games BIGGER give keys to him for free, In 1 year when he get bored about that U will ask ¿Why nobody make content of my game?

Discrepancies?  :-\
Sorry to hear that. What happened exactly?

It was in 2012 and i was a kid  ;D

Some guy did a mod of Aleix Espargaro motorbike and he asked me for a key to test the game and u didnt give me it because the game was still too bad and buggy. So i got mad and felt i was losing my time trying to make the game grow so i left it.

I think the game is much better in terms of bugs now, u only need to improve the netcode bugs and it's close to the perfection to be honest.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2018, 08:05:00 PM by PiBoSo »
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PiBoSo

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2018, 04:11:10 PM »
If u check a bit the content of this guy u have two main content:

1) Videos abount mainstream games like AssettoCorsa Competizione, Project Cars, F1 2018 ... So, this guy is looking for creating content that is mainstream in that moment to get tons of visits = money.

2) Reviews of products: If u check the links that this guy put in the descriptions all of them are refferals, that means that Fanatec and the other brand products are paying this guy for this review. More people visiting the web via the refferal link = more money = he create good content talking albout it.

3) All content of this guy have the objective of enterntain because If people see all video Youtube algoritm improves ur rating as youtuber, so he have to make entertaining content racing online, testing multiple tracks, showing something interesting, etc... KRP have not so much content and the most important, he will play alone, so It's kinda hard create entertaining content that makes people stay watching all video. (This point is the less important).

He just ignore the petition of the KRP because is not mainstream game and u are not paying him to do it, it's verysimple. It's not a conspiracy, it's just how world works.

Ok, thank you.
All makes sense.

I was never worried about a conspiracy, but that I somehow built a negative reputation. Looks like it's even worse. I am irrelevant  :'(
« Last Edit: November 06, 2018, 08:04:38 PM by PiBoSo »
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Hawk

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2018, 05:30:44 PM »
@Piboso: Just to point out - The guy in the video didn't "flat out refuse" to play Kart Racing Pro, he said, "I've not tried Kart Racing Pro", two totally different meanings altogether mate..... Sounds like he's just never even thought of playing Kart Racing Pro..... Why? Probably cause even if he's heard of it before it's simply slipped his mind with it not being promoted well? It's probably as simple as that Pib.

Sounds to me like your best path to take for some good promo work that wouldn't cost you a dime would be to start holding "Official" live-stream events/championships yourself.... This would be fantastic PR activity as well as strongly allowing you to focus on determining any blindingly obvious issues/bugs to help focus product development and updates needed(Great genuine feedback opportunity).... Do this one day per week and regard it as an investment of your time for product promotion, PR and testing - Very important for sales these days. ;)


PiBoSo

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2018, 05:52:01 PM »
Sounds to me like your best path to take for some good promo work that wouldn't cost you a dime would be to start holding "Official" live-stream events/championships yourself.... This would be fantastic PR activity as well as strongly allowing you to focus on determining any blindingly obvious issues/bugs to help focus product development and updates needed(Great genuine feedback opportunity).... Do this one day per week and regard it as an investment of your time for product promotion, PR and testing - Very important for sales these days. ;)

Yeah, I was thinking the same.
However, it make it truly interesting, there must be some money involved, probably in the form of physical prizes...
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PiBoSo

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2018, 08:05:27 PM »
@Piboso: Just to point out - The guy in the video didn't "flat out refuse" to play Kart Racing Pro, he said, "I've not tried Kart Racing Pro", two totally different meanings altogether mate.....

Whoops  :-[
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Hawk

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2018, 09:38:35 AM »
Sounds to me like your best path to take for some good promo work that wouldn't cost you a dime would be to start holding "Official" live-stream events/championships yourself.... This would be fantastic PR activity as well as strongly allowing you to focus on determining any blindingly obvious issues/bugs to help focus product development and updates needed(Great genuine feedback opportunity).... Do this one day per week and regard it as an investment of your time for product promotion, PR and testing - Very important for sales these days. ;)

Yeah, I was thinking the same.
However, it make it truly interesting, there must be some money involved, probably in the form of physical prizes...

Well not necessarily Piboso...... I mean yes, money or physical prizes would be an added attraction and a good bonus for participating in the "Official" live events, but personally speaking I would just concentrate on getting the event/s off the ground first, get them going and established with the right format, you know, then take any further additions and ideas you may have to include in the events from there...... Maybe even try and get a sponsor to stump-up a physical prize or two for championship winners?

But yeah mate, great idea Pib!  ;) 8) 

Corrie

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2018, 02:10:38 PM »
I've been around KRP since 2012 and have seen a lot of what has gone on. I'm not meaning to stir anything up, but I do have some thoughts.

We used to have a huge and thriving racing community that livestreamed, raced in massive events, and had some of the best racers competing. This league, which I'm sure that PiBoSo doesn't like, was called the Sim Karting World Championship. It checked every box that PiBoSo has been looking for, in terms of broad reach (we had 14 different countries racing on track together), competition, and promotion. We had people who would live-stream our events and we even made full commentated race videos. Our biggest race had 27 people racing on track together. This was probably the biggest series in KRP's time and it lasted from 2013 to 2016, which is incredible in my opinion. What killed the league was the inability for modders to change crucial pieces of the game which hindered our ability to run a league. Stuff like custom physics, which was decrypted in late 2016 if I'm not mistaken, killed the league's participation. Additionally, because KRP would only display 12 karts on track, we had to limit our Pre-Final and Finals to 12 karts, meaning over half the field didn't make the main event. We constantly asked for the ability to see more than 12 karts, and that ability was added in 2017, which is exactly why SKWC eventually stopped running.

I'm not trying to say that SKWC was the greatest thing that happened to KRP, but what I am saying is that we presented a unique opportunity to PiBoSo, to which there was no development or response for years. We had a huge amount of skill in our driver pool, many modders helping develop content, and a huge amount of feedback on bugs and game mechanics. The big take-away here is that, in my opinion, PiBoSo ignored the biggest part of the community for nearly 3 years. In that time, the racing community thrived and then died on the back of a time when the developer wouldn't help make the game more playable in the scope that we had hoped for.

In no way am I saying that PiBoSo is solely responsible - there were plenty of kids in SKWC who made arguments and unpleasantness on the forums, but I do think that KRP definitely had the potential to grow if things had been quickly implemented after they were suggested. I know development time is expensive, but KRP still has the makings of a great sim. Right now, the netcode is its biggest downfall. Once we can run 15+ karts on track without crazy rubber-banding, I'm sure a league will pop up that will get people interested again.

I'm not trying to point fingers, just relaying what I've thought while reading this thread.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2018, 02:12:58 PM by Corrie »

Stout Johnson

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2018, 03:01:26 PM »
I agree to some extent with Corrie. KRP per se is a treasure. It is loads of fun. I used to race with some GPB guys (who mostly are noobs on 4 wheels) and still it was a hell lot of fun. Technically, it IS a great sim and objectively THE sim for karting. I do not want to get scientific here, because I bet nobody can definitely say why KRP is not lifting off as expected. I think it is a good mix of very conservative marketing, long development history, netcode issues, partially less-than-optimal atmosphere in the KRP Forum (at least it used to be for some time).

So I think what it lacks, is the great interest to begin with and the lack of active community and regular online races in the process which would help make it grow. If somehow that spark which could (re-)ignite the fire among many simmers, it could still be a great title. Just make sure there are no turn offs like instability issues with this sim. Because this will just make people quit. If there are no people online, there are no races. No races - no fun - no racing streams - no YouTube Videos - no market penetration. Simple as that imo. Don't look for anything magical or even a 'conspiracy'.

People will do start things which SEEM to be fun (Marketing, Reviews, YouTube), but will only continue Things which ARE fun (netcode, stability, people playing online). Get those last things done, and you are good.
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PiBoSo

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2018, 04:51:11 PM »

Bottom line is, the youtubers don't seem to be interested in informing their viewers.
They are not trend-setters. It looks quite the opposite actually.
They make videos about what is already popular to harvest views and that's it.

KRP is not popular, hence no videos.
Obviously your ambition outweighs your talent

Stout Johnson

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2018, 05:13:30 PM »

Bottom line is, the youtubers don't seem to be interested in informing their viewers.
They are not trend-setters. It looks quite the opposite actually.
They make videos about what is already popular to harvest views and that's it.

KRP is not popular, hence no videos.
It is true, for youtubers a video is their product and they try to get as many views as possible. But if KRP would be trending on its own among sim-lovers, it would get it's share of love among sim youtubers. From what it looks like, the conclusion is that you cannot rely on youtubers spreading news of your product KRP. Ok, it would make it easier. But don't give up and don't take this as the sole explanation. Keep working mate. Focus on your priorities in terms of finishing your products. In the end, if the sim deserves it, it will get its spotlight sooner or later. Cream always rises to the top ;) But again: make sure your products are 100% stable for online play. It is the most important thing atm imo.
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janaucarre

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #25 on: November 07, 2018, 05:21:45 PM »
Hy as said before, and aince long years, the first problem is online bugs. I remember years ago trying to make races with 5 or 8 People, restart the race, qualif, so many times fo having all people on the grid until the start, so many hours to try to load some who has the worst connection line before other, ao many hours decrease the paint size for less ping, and so and so.
And so,  most people i ride with years ago were gone elsewhere.
I know piboso you read this forum since the start and see netcode problem, please solve it, and more, but it seems it is really the first, the number one problem as said here post before that the communication doesnt grow around your sims.
Thank you for all of your time and for the best bike kart sim ever. We are not massiv community that can play with problem since so long years.

Thanks

Manu

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #26 on: November 07, 2018, 06:10:47 PM »

Bottom line is, the youtubers don't seem to be interested in informing their viewers.
They are not trend-setters. It looks quite the opposite actually.
They make videos about what is already popular to harvest views and that's it.

KRP is not popular, hence no videos.

And your other three products? MXB GPB WRS

I sincerely believe that if you dedicate only to two of them you would have more relevance.


Just think of all the motorcycle games that have appeared in recent years with a lot of speculation and interest.

A simulator can stand out a lot between them. As I see it, motorcycle simulators can have better opportunities. It is still on time.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2018, 07:19:07 PM by Manu »

philiaN

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2018, 02:38:02 AM »
The key for success is marketing.

There is a reason why big companys put billion of dollars into it, but let me tell you that you can actually reach more people for free.. and without putting in alot of work hours.

Work together with your community! I'm pretty sure there will be willing people to help you with the following steps to promote the brand PiBoSo. And this is actually the first thing, don't split your simulations on your main website.

Let's face the fact, you are a genius developer, but definitely the opposite when it comes to marketing, design and content (news) ... and you dont have to be! You should def. think about to outsource those things you aren't good at or simply doenst have the time for.

Step 1: Let someone make you a new Piboso website with the structure of blizzard.com (e.g.) (wordpress - i could even spend you my betheme licence)
- Under the navigation point "eSports" - "You" should organize official championships for each simulation with the results of each race and the overall standings. (no need for any prizes)
- Add "Development Log" to the main navigation
- get moderators for news (esport, standings) and other content like videos/screenshots with required authorization of you to post each article
- make some pleasing dark tones for the forums and use the same theme for every forum

Step 2: Let someone make you new logos for each simulation, they are more than outdated specially mxb and gpb.
For example i asked my brother what he thinks how old mx bikes is based on the logo - his answer: around 2000.
Game Menu is ok - it's simple and minimal - i just would advise you to use a different font and also some dark tones for the sub menu backgrounds (dark grey) - as reference you can use discord colors

Step 3: Get a facebook page for PiBoSo and promote all your simulations on that. Same here get some mods for it who are willing to post some media (with authorization of the post)
- You dont need twitter, instagram or snapchat.. e.g lcq has already 3k followers on fb - you have 80 on twitter (i made a twitter account only for mxb)

Step4: Get mods for your youtube channel

lluisete

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2018, 10:58:21 AM »
The best form to get people is to use influencers marketing. They are the best on what they do and they get money in base of the repercusion, so u will always win more money that the paid to them.

U can't start making championships when u have no people playing ur game, first get people then make the people CONTINUE IN UR GAME so people that comes after will stay and then UR GAME WILL GROW. I think that having big studios making car games u should focus in GPB because u have no real competence in motorbike simulators.

In the case of GPB I think the game is enought good to keep people playing, just need to get more vision. It's too hard to find this game because its 0 investment in SEO/SEM Google and in Youtube, If you uses good influencers they will find the best form to show the game to people who can be interested (they know how to make attractive content, know how to use keywords to get more people, etc).

In Spain there is only one youtuber who is doing content about GPB (Jorge) and he have 23k subscribers and he did that a lot of people knows about the game and some of them bought it. U can just connect discord at nights and see how Spanish channel always have 6-10 persons, imagine the case of bigger influencers and from different countrys.

And one important thing, changue the 125cc from the demo. It's a boring bike, put some easy to ride and more funny bike because a lot of people who test the game crash some times in boxes and then unistall the game. Just see videos from people who test the game, they all are always crashing on boxes and starts to flame. Put a more fun bike so people get a better initial impresion = more % of buy the game.

U did the hardest part, making the best simulator. Only thing that u have to do is contact with people who are better than you getting repercusion and let them do their work.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2018, 11:17:43 AM by lluisete »
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Furious

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Re: PiBoSo and simracing youtubers
« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2018, 08:04:19 PM »

Bottom line is, the youtubers don't seem to be interested in informing their viewers.
They are not trend-setters. It looks quite the opposite actually.
They make videos about what is already popular to harvest views and that's it.

KRP is not popular, hence no videos.

I would agree. KRP is so opposite of being hot that no one even considered to mention it in KartKraft videos. I have to add that I was also hoping for KRP to pop out along with kart racing theme.

But to think what can be done in that department I can suggest this:

1. You have to go out to entities that already acknowledge KRP and ask them to review/check it out. Correct me if I'm wrong but Race Department has been putting out news about KRP's updates since years. They would do comparison.

2. Go out to entities that could objectively rate KRP's values despite those aspects making it unpopular. One youtuber I would recommend is EmptyBox.

Overall, I guess being absent from market ( in marketing and promoting part of it ) causes KRP ( and probably others ) being considered dead.

Still, hope this helps at all.

much love