Longer races please Nick...

[Hawk]

Just want to say that I personally would like to have longer races, more laps.
I say this because it totally alters the race from a sprint(anything below 15 laps) which favours the fast hotlap guys, to more of a strategy type race which helps bring the slower guys into the equation. It would just bring a little more realism into the events I feel.

Also I would like to see races that bring in the use of the Hard compound tyres, which again alters the type of race a rider runs(slower because of the compound, also not so able to hang it out there without falling like you can do with the soft compound; and it's not that often that the lap count or track has warranted the use of MED/Hard tyres. Would just be a nice change I think. 

Anyway... Just some ideas to mull over to mix things up a bit more for the events.

Hawk.

[Napalm Nick]

Okedoke all good with me I have stuck it on our Suggestions List too which I delve into when I am seeking inspiration (good time to bump the topic to draw new members to it too).

We ran a long race at Aragon (borderline medium/long race) that made members contemplate Hards.  We ran into temperature problems due to the hot day too. More info to make it strategic.

Do we have proof that aggressive riding wears the tyres more than strategic smoothness though? Is there a benefit for slower guys? Just feeding the conversation with thoughts.

[BOBR6 84]

Do we have proof that aggressive riding wears the tyres more than strategic smoothness though?

Gooood question!

[Napalm Nick]

I tell you what might be a good track to test the theory - JJ's Hengelo.

It writes off a pair of Softs in about 6 laps so some casual riding there vs a mad thrash would give interesting results.

Are you accepting that chellenge BoB? 

[JJS209]

my first thought is that an increase of three laps should not be underestimated.
for SSP 18 laps are a good race distance, maybe 20.

15 laps on a SSP are as well not that stressful as it is on a SBK bike.
in SBK CC the last laps were sometimes truly paintful in my tensed up hands.
so the race distance linked to the class you ride.

€: my personal relaxed to stressful racing class scale:
125cc - 250cc/Moto3 - Moto2 - SSP600 STK1000 - SBK/GP1000

[Hawk]

my first thought is that an increase of three laps should not be underestimated.
for SSP 18 laps are a good race distance, maybe 20.

15 laps on a SSP are as well not that stressful as it is on a SBK bike.
in SBK CC the last laps were sometimes truly paintful in my tensed up hands.
so the race distance linked to the class you ride.

€: my personal relaxed to stressful racing class scale:
125cc - 250cc/Moto3 - Moto2 - SSP600 STK1000 - SBK/GP1000

How are you going to manage in the "Classic Daytona 200 "race? That's going to be 50+ laps! 

No seriously I know what you mean because I tend to get numb hands after about 15 laps with my controller(I won't say Joystick or I'm bound to get some smart-alec making a smutty comment. Lol).
But anyway, this is at least in part what I'm talking about with making longer races a totally different ball-game; riders will have to take it easier and relax more if they don't want there hands going numb or cramped.. Just part of a riders ability to win a race, right?  Makes it more interesting than a sprint to the line over 10 - 15 laps. 

Hawk.

[JJS209]

i agree

[Hawk]

Okedoke all good with me I have stuck it on our Suggestions List too which I delve into when I am seeking inspiration (good time to bump the topic to draw new members to it too).

We ran a long race at Aragon (borderline medium/long race) that made members contemplate Hards.  We ran into temperature problems due to the hot day too. More info to make it strategic.

Do we have proof that aggressive riding wears the tyres more than strategic smoothness though? Is there a benefit for slower guys? Just feeding the conversation with thoughts.

Thanks Nick. 

That is a very interesting question about the possibility of aggressive riding making tyres wear faster.... Would be fantastic if that was the case, though somehow I doubt that is the case but would definitely be worth testing to find out. 

Well I think there is a benefit for slower riders in a long race.... A bit like the tortoise and the hair theory. I personally don't think most of the fast guys can adapt to a long strategic race(The gauntlet is thrown down! Let the rage begin! Hehe ). I think most of the fast hot-lap guys are hardwired into sprint type racing and will faulter mid-way and towards the end of a race?
But a longer race lends itself for riders to take it easier and make less mistakes... In other words, ride well within ourselves and not make so many mistakes(strategy); but this is just another part of what I'm talking about with strategy for longer races.

It will be interesting how many of the fast guys continue to win races like they do now when racing the long races; also just how many of the slower guys start to win or dramatically come closer to winning in the longer races. It will be interesting. 

Hawk.

[matty0l215]

Indy endurance race 50 laps enough

[BOBR6 84]

Lol i would do a 50 lapper  maybe.. 

id like some proper gp races too on the 500s or 1000s .. craving some more road racing after Hengelo though! great event that was  maybe go again with dynamic surface sometime..

Nick.. yeah il do some laps see what happens, or maybe piboso could tell us?

[Napalm Nick]

We need a study into fuel capacity lol.  Remember Spa? The GP250 couldn't hold enough for the original intended laps.

Having said that it could of if you tweaked the Drivetrain/gear ratios to extend fuel/lap (which it does for definite, because I specifically checked).

Next Track-race maybe we can look at the fuel useage/per lap (MaxHud) and work a race length close to full consumption which will then mean looking at tyre wear and choice. It will be interesting and perhaps ground not yet chartered? 

Late edit: Thanks Bob much appreciated 

[matty0l215]

We need a study into fuel capacity lol.  Remember Spa? The GP250 couldn't hold enough for the original intended laps.

Having said that it could of if you tweaked the Drivetrain/gear ratios to extend fuel/lap (which it does for definite, because I specifically checked).

Next Track-race maybe we can look at the fuel useage/per lap (MaxHud) and work a race length close to full consumption which will then mean looking at tyre wear and choice. It will be interesting and perhaps ground not yet chartered? 

Late edit: Thanks Bob much appreciated 

Could we not just adjust the fuel level of thw bikes (beta club 500 GP!)

[Hawk]

We need a study into fuel capacity lol.  Remember Spa? The GP250 couldn't hold enough for the original intended laps.

Having said that it could of if you tweaked the Drivetrain/gear ratios to extend fuel/lap (which it does for definite, because I specifically checked).

Next Track-race maybe we can look at the fuel useage/per lap (MaxHud) and work a race length close to full consumption which will then mean looking at tyre wear and choice. It will be interesting and perhaps ground not yet chartered? 

Late edit: Thanks Bob much appreciated 

Could we not just adjust the fuel level of thw bikes (beta club 500 GP!)

+1 Matty
This is a good idea, but we would need permissions from the bike authors to alter the fuel capacity of their bikes, but like you say we could do that as a special endurance race bike package.... Either that, or alter the bike fuel usage rates?

Depending on tyre tests, we may also need to alter the tyre wear and heat rates too, as we may find that tyres overheat as well as wear too quick over 50+ laps?

Hawk.

[BOBR6 84]

Biggest problem doing 50+ laps would be finger pump! 

[matty0l215]

We need a study into fuel capacity lol.  Remember Spa? The GP250 couldn't hold enough for the original intended laps.

Having said that it could of if you tweaked the Drivetrain/gear ratios to extend fuel/lap (which it does for definite, because I specifically checked).

Next Track-race maybe we can look at the fuel useage/per lap (MaxHud) and work a race length close to full consumption which will then mean looking at tyre wear and choice. It will be interesting and perhaps ground not yet chartered? 

Late edit: Thanks Bob much appreciated 

Could we not just adjust the fuel level of thw bikes (beta club 500 GP!)

+1 Matty
This is a good idea, but we would need permissions from the bike authors to alter the fuel capacity of their bikes, but like you say we could do that as a special endurance race bike package.... Either that, or alter the bike fuel usage rates?

Depending on tyre tests, we may also need to alter the tyre wear and heat rates too, as we may find that tyres overheat as well as wear too quick over 50+ laps?

Hawk.

Oh obviously we would need permisions from the autor

As for the tyres, hards on the 500s already seen to last a good while (maybe not 50 laps of indy )