"Our true nationality is mankind." H.G. Wells
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
So, go Scotland!!!
https://www.youtube.com/v/PSH0eRKq1lE
Scottish patriot are we?? :P
I'd hate to see Scotland split from the UK, but if they do decide to split then quite frankly they are fools to think they can afford to run Scotland on a sole Scottish economy; they just haven't thought things through properly.
One thing I'd envy them... at least they'd automatically be out of the EU. Lol.
Can't wait for the UK referendum on UK coming out of the EU... GO UKIP!! ;D 8)
Hawk.
As the UK is open to everybody and anybody..
Maybe scotland want to make it difficult to enter!?
Just incase HornetMaX decides to go back! Hehe :P
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 17, 2014, 09:00:44 PM
As the UK is open to everybody and anybody..
Maybe scotland want to make it difficult to enter!?
Just incase HornetMaX decides to go back! Hehe :P
Their going to rebuild the wall!
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 17, 2014, 09:00:44 PM
As the UK is open to everybody and anybody..
Maybe scotland want to make it difficult to enter!?
Just incase HornetMaX decides to go back! Hehe :P
LOL!! ;D ;D
Hawk.
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 17, 2014, 07:42:02 PM
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
The little I've seen in Scotland, I think Scotland would be far better off if they split from the UK.
6 months ago, discussing with friends up there, I said I was not so sure the NO would win: everybody (scotts, brits and even some immigrants living there) dismissed the idea saying "no way, it's never gonna happen".
The way the UK handled the last 6 months of campaign (i.e. making no campaign at all), is just ridiculous and is the main reason why the YES has been going all the way up.
The recent comment from D.Cameron is just incredible: I mean, you're dealing with somebody who wants to leave you and you try to convince him/her to stay saying "careful, if you leave me then it's forever". :o
UK is ultra-liberal (bedroom tax ? really ?): the leftwing parties in the UK would be centrist at best in the rest of europe. Scotland aims for something more social, it's no news they look at Norway as a role model. The two are juts not compatible from the start.
The funny thing is that in general, nationalist parties are the one using fear as an argument (mostly, fear of immigration), while in SCO/UK it's the opposite: the nationalist are optimist and forward looking, the others use fear as an argument (fear of economics, fear of having to have a passport to go to england, fear of having a different currency, ...).
The one that should seriously start thinking about where they are headed are the ones in the UK: I'm not a bug EU fan (at least not in its current form), but I don't really see the situation that good for UK if you decide to leave the EU (even if I do think that, given the level of participation of the UK in the EU, they should not be in from the start).
And as a last argument, Scotland has (in my opinion) the 2nd best 6 nations anthem (sorry, but I have to put Ireland's call at #1), why England's hymn is childish:
QuoteGod save our gracious Queen,
Long live our noble Queen,
God save the Queen !
Please ... ;D
Go Scotland, for me too !
MaX.
If they've got any sense they'll vote a resounding YES and then leave NATO also..
Moi? Controversial?
grT ;)
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 17, 2014, 07:42:02 PM
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 18, 2014, 10:07:59 AM
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 17, 2014, 07:42:02 PM
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...
Piboso... Now that would be the ideal. ;D ;D 8)
One world one government, everyone willing to help each other and getting along great. But while we live in an monetary economic world tortured on top by twisted religious fanatics it will never happen. There are too many power hungry and selfish people in power of this world at this time in history.... They know they have the technological means to solve our energy problems, they know they have the means for us all to live comfortably, they know they have the means to cure most diseases, but that doesn't make them any money so they suppress those technologies from us.
The bankers now hold the real power in this world, have done since approx 1969 when the system reverted from relying on a countries gold reserves to relying totally on bankers to fund a countries growth. This started the economic cycle of boom and bust, the cycle of lending money(the boom years) until money reserves become short, then the bankers decide it's time to rebalance the money reserves(the bust years) and therefore have to stop lending until the money reserves are replenished..... Then it all starts again, over and over. But the sad truth is that the bankers always want countries and their populations to be in deep debt to them, this is how they stay in power and make huge amounts of money too.
After what they did to the financial world back in 2008, all they got was a slap on the wrist for public consumption and allowed to carry on business as usual. Why? Because the reality is that it's the bankers who have the real power in this world not politicians.
This is the world debt clock "LIVE". All funded by bankers..... Imagine the interest they are making from this ever increasing figure. It's shocking!! :o :o
http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/
(http://www.nationaldebtclocks.org/)
We have got ourselves into a right mess, and no one has the guts to stop it. But there will come a time when it will all collapse and then a new world will emerge like a phoenix from ashes, and the sooner the better! ;D
Hawk.
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 17, 2014, 07:42:02 PM
"Our true nationality is mankind." H.G. Wells
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
"you know is sad but true"
but maybe some day...
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 18, 2014, 10:07:59 AM
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 17, 2014, 07:42:02 PM
But since this doesn't seem to be the general consensus, then let's push the pedal to the metal, and split in more and more nations, until we have a state for each city, maybe the final result will be the same ;D
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...
"You may say that I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one". :)
I've got a great idea! Let's hand over the bankers and politicians including that dickhead cameron to the IS......
Quote from: Toomes1 on September 18, 2014, 05:24:04 PM
I've got a great idea! Let's hand over the bankers and politicians including that dickhead cameron to the IS......
Careful what you say... You could get raided by the Met Anti-Terrorist Division.....
What a world we live in eh. Lol
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
A word on Ebola: I find it amazing that as soon as we get an outbreak of a virus that could potentially threaten the worlds population and stability they can come up with a vaccine within weeks after decades of them telling us that there is no vaccine(despite research) to combat Ebola.... Anyone else suspect they had knowledge of a vaccine all the time?
All this fast-track testing of this so called new vaccine on humans before it's ready is just a way to cover their arses because they already had the knowledge of how to cure Ebola already! The only reason they've released the vaccine is because this outbreak is threatening to go worldwide. It will be interesting to see if they are willing to spend the money to produce enough of this new vaccine to treat all who are infected and not just the privileged few?
A word on Ukraine: Simple... I think we should give Putin a good kicking and kick his arse out of Ukraine(that includes Ukrainian Crimea). And if there are any Russians in the Ukraine who don't like it then they should quite simply go back home to Russia were they belong. If I was in France and didn't like the way it was governed I wouldn't expect the UK Armed forces to invade France and declare it part of the UK. LOL
The west and NATO's response to what Putin has done in Ukraine is absolutely pathetic! You can't appease people like Putin or he'll just take more and more.... We should've called his bluff. He's just a lying corrupt power hungry little Hitler!
A word on the Middle East Problems: Quite frankly, I'd let them fight their own battles...... Why should we help them anymore? As soon as we've helped them get what they want they stab us in the back every time.
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: Toomes1 on September 18, 2014, 05:24:04 PM
I've got a great idea! Let's hand over the bankers and politicians including that dickhead cameron to the IS......
Careful what you say... You could get raided by the Met Anti-Terrorist Division.....
What a world we live in eh. Lol
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
A word on Ebola: I find it amazing that as soon as we get an outbreak of a virus that could potentially threaten the worlds population and stability they can come up with a vaccine within weeks after decades of them telling us that there is no vaccine(despite research) to combat Ebola.... Anyone else suspect they had knowledge of a vaccine all the time?
All this fast-track testing of this so called new vaccine on humans before it's ready is just a way to cover their arses because they already had the knowledge of how to cure Ebola already! The only reason they've released the vaccine is because this outbreak is threatening to go worldwide. It will be interesting to see if they are willing to spend the money to produce enough of this new vaccine to treat all who are infected and not just the privileged few?
A word on Ukraine: Simple... I think we should give Putin a good kicking and kick his arse out of Ukraine(that includes Ukrainian Crimea). And if there are any Russians in the Ukraine who don't like it then they should quite simply go back home to Russia were they belong. If I was in France and didn't like the way it was governed I wouldn't expect the UK Armed forces to invade France and declare it part of the UK. LOL
The west and NATO's response to what Putin has done in Ukraine is absolutely pathetic! You can't appease people like Putin or he'll just take more and more.... We should've called his bluff. He's just a lying corrupt power hungry little Hitler!
A word on the Middle East Problems: Quite frankly, I'd let them fight their own battles...... Why should we help them anymore? As soon as we've helped them get what they want they stab us in the back every time.
Hawk.
Without taking sides on this the alternative explanation is certainly interesting.
http://scgnews.com/the-geopolitics-of-world-war-iii
grT
YAY!! Conspiracy theories ;D ;D haha :P
There's no real need for alternative explanations: no matter how hard a docor could work to save lives, no matter how good an invention could be to increase life quality, no matter how much progress one could introduce in the civil society, a small bunch of greedy bastards will always be there to screw everything in the name of profit.
Anyway, back on topic: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2014/sep/17/scottish-referendum-explained-for-non-brits-video
:)
MaX.
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 18, 2014, 07:14:09 PM
Anyway, back on topic: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2014/sep/17/scottish-referendum-explained-for-non-brits-videoMaX.
I'm sorry but our island is a witch riding a pig not a troll....
Quote from: matty0l215 on September 18, 2014, 07:16:12 PM
I'm sorry but our island is a witch riding a pig not a troll....
It doesn't make it any less embarrassing, but OK, whatever ... :)
MaX.
Quote from: matty0l215 on September 18, 2014, 07:13:07 PM
YAY!! Conspiracy theories ;D ;D haha :P
I thought that might get you lot going. ;)
Of course the biggest conspiracy theory of all is arguably that offered for consummation by the unsuspecting masses by the mainstream media machine.. dare I say it!? ?
Petrodollar recycling certainly ain't no conspiracy theory that's for sure.
As for Scotland. No surprise really but I think they're going to bottle it..
grT ;D
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 06:56:43 PM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: Toomes1 on September 18, 2014, 05:24:04 PM
I've got a great idea! Let's hand over the bankers and politicians including that dickhead cameron to the IS......
Careful what you say... You could get raided by the Met Anti-Terrorist Division.....
What a world we live in eh. Lol
Quote from: iVolution on September 17, 2014, 11:22:16 PM
In or out the EU/UK, we are all screwed anyway so why bother ;D. Any thoughts on real issues such as the Gaza conflict, Syria, The Fappening, IS, Ebola or Ukraine while you are at it ? ;)
A word on Ebola: I find it amazing that as soon as we get an outbreak of a virus that could potentially threaten the worlds population and stability they can come up with a vaccine within weeks after decades of them telling us that there is no vaccine(despite research) to combat Ebola.... Anyone else suspect they had knowledge of a vaccine all the time?
All this fast-track testing of this so called new vaccine on humans before it's ready is just a way to cover their arses because they already had the knowledge of how to cure Ebola already! The only reason they've released the vaccine is because this outbreak is threatening to go worldwide. It will be interesting to see if they are willing to spend the money to produce enough of this new vaccine to treat all who are infected and not just the privileged few?
A word on Ukraine: Simple... I think we should give Putin a good kicking and kick his arse out of Ukraine(that includes Ukrainian Crimea). And if there are any Russians in the Ukraine who don't like it then they should quite simply go back home to Russia were they belong. If I was in France and didn't like the way it was governed I wouldn't expect the UK Armed forces to invade France and declare it part of the UK. LOL
The west and NATO's response to what Putin has done in Ukraine is absolutely pathetic! You can't appease people like Putin or he'll just take more and more.... We should've called his bluff. He's just a lying corrupt power hungry little Hitler!
A word on the Middle East Problems: Quite frankly, I'd let them fight their own battles...... Why should we help them anymore? As soon as we've helped them get what they want they stab us in the back every time.
Hawk.
Without taking sides on this the alternative explanation is certainly interesting.
http://scgnews.com/the-geopolitics-of-world-war-iii
grT
This is certainly very interesting...... Also shows the very real dangers of not telling the public the truth... if this is the truth? Who knows?? :)
Hawk.
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 07:31:34 PM
Of course the biggest conspiracy theory of all is arguably that offered for consummation by the unsuspecting masses by the mainstream media machine.. dare I say it!? ?
The double by in your statement is confusing ... oh wait ... maybe you did it on purpose, to make your theory less understandable :)
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 07:31:34 PM
As for Scotland. No surprise really but I think they're going to bottle it..
That is (was ?) the very foundation of the NO camp. No argument, no discussion, just a cheeky smile meaning "yeah, yeah .. anyway you'll vote no".
Could be the case, but it's a hell of a gamble.
Funny: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/18/scottish-vote-no-exit-poll-democratic-deficit (http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/18/scottish-vote-no-exit-poll-democratic-deficit)
In a nutshell: there will be no exit polls. Why ? (quote) "because neither the BBC nor any other media outlet has bothered to pay to get one done".
If the NO wins, Scotland is all in for a decade of severe bullying from their southern friends.
If the YES wins, I can bet from now that in 3-4 weeks time maximum, some prominent english politician will say that in the end, it's better for the (not so) United Kingdom to have let Scotland go.
MaX.
P.S.
Did I ever mention that I'm a Ian Rankin (Inspector Rebus) fan ?
Just to say ... he's for the YES, while JK Rowling and her Harry Potter are for the NO ... shouldn't be hard to chose :)
Just my bad English Max. Wasn't trying to bestow any sort of special meaning of any sort..
All I would say is that we owe it to ourselves to question everything in this day and age. Particularly so the big issues of our time. Frankly I for one do not take anything the mainstream media tells me at face value. And that goes for the BBC reporting of what Alex Sammond did not say or more importantly did say in response to questions from the BBC's Nick Robinson. My father warned me about the BBC before he passed away. Ever since the Andrew Gilligan affair he lost his trust in the Corporation completely..
I fear the negative campaigning will triumph on this one Max. Which is not the way such a victory should be achieved in my view on something this important. A more mature, open and honest debate would have been preferable. But does such conduct exist any longer in affairs of this nature?
grT ;)
Ahhhhhh.... :)
I can't add something to the discussion because it can take to much words to write.
The star trek like can happens a day, perhaps:)
No more money, no more war on earth, people having all what they need and working for each other and elevating their comprehension if the universe...
I'm a dreamer and i hope all thing will come better for everybody in a near future, perahps we will be not dead until that.
Long life and prosperity. \/
Bound to be a simple reason.. Oil maybe?
Bedroom tax! Is that actually in force in scotland? That would be enough for me to vote yes if I was scottish.
I always vote for simple things like closed gates to more foreign workers!
This country is fu#ked! Uk is the laughing stock of europe.. If not the world! If scotland want out of the EU.. I envy them.
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 18, 2014, 08:40:02 PM
Bound to be a simple reason.. Oil maybe?
Bedroom tax! Is that actually in force in scotland? That would be enough for me to vote yes if I was scottish.
I always vote for simple things like closed gates to more foreign workers!
This country is fu#ked! Uk is the laughing stock of europe.. If not the world! If scotland want out of the EU.. I envy them.
If Scotland got a referendum for independence then surly we can get one for in/out of the eu
Wow reading this topic is just to deep for me. Whatever seems to be big news today always ends up being someone's profit tomorrow.
It's a dam shame that we are lead by a bunch of pricks who think they can provide a better life for us all.
To be honest if the world ever started to break down there's only three people close to my heart I need to save.
Quote from: janaucarre on September 18, 2014, 08:38:54 PM
Ahhhhhh.... :)
I can't add something to the discussion because it can take to much words to write.
The star trek like can happens a day, perhaps:)
No more money, no more war on earth, people having all what they need and working for each other and elevating their comprehension if the universe...
I'm a dreamer and i hope all thing will come better for everybody in a near future, perahps we will be not dead until that.
Long life and prosperity. \/
Agree 1000000% .
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
A word on Ukraine: Simple... I think we should give Putin a good kicking and kick his arse out of Ukraine(that includes Ukrainian Crimea). And if there are any Russians in the Ukraine who don't like it then they should quite simply go back home to Russia were they belong. If I was in France and didn't like the way it was governed I wouldn't expect the UK Armed forces to invade France and declare it part of the UK. LOL
The west and NATO's response to what Putin has done in Ukraine is absolutely pathetic! You can't appease people like Putin or he'll just take more and more.... We should've called his bluff. He's just a lying corrupt power hungry little Hitler!
It's not so "simple" when you consider that the anti-government protests in Ukraine were led by Nazists ::)
Dangerous nationalists, anti-semitic, that surely don't like and protect minorities ( like the russian-speaking ones ); and supported by part of the right-wing of the US: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/15/john-mccain-ukraine-protests-support-just-cause
Things are not so black and white, uh? :-\
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 18, 2014, 08:40:02 PM
Bedroom tax! Is that actually in force in scotland? That would be enough for me to vote yes if I was scottish.
It is. I even think the Scottish government asked london the permission to locally waive it (with cottish money, of course), and london, of course, said .. NO. :o
Quote from: matty0l215 on September 18, 2014, 08:43:26 PM
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 18, 2014, 08:40:02 PM
This country is fu#ked! Uk is the laughing stock of europe.. If not the world! If scotland want out of the EU.. I envy them.
If Scotland got a referendum for independence then surly we can get one for in/out of the eu
Scotland wants to stay in the EU. It's England that has a referendum in 2017 to decide in/out of EU.
I mean, you live there and you don't know that ? That speaks a lot about how much the politics in England is far from its citizens ..
MaX.
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 18, 2014, 10:31:17 PM
Scotland wants to stay in the EU. It's England that has a referendum in 2017 to decide in/out of EU.
I mean, you live there and you don't know that ? That speaks a lot about how much the politics in England is far from its citizens ..
Ah, me not knowing is because i really don't give a toss whatever happens I know I'm never going to make a difference in the decision (One of my reasons I've got no intention of ever voting). Morons will lead this country for years to come, that is politics (at least UK politics).
And now i am bored of the subject :P So good night :-X
Lol sadly I agree.. No matter who is in power they all say one thing to get there, then do the same as the party before when they do.
UKIP are popular now because they vow to cap immigration! Thats all I care about at the moment..
The fact is though.. Conservative vowed to tackle that issue too. They wont stand up to the EU though!
Besides it makes the rich even richer so why would they?
Quote from: PiBoSo on September 18, 2014, 09:21:03 PM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 06:33:41 PM
A word on Ukraine: Simple... I think we should give Putin a good kicking and kick his arse out of Ukraine(that includes Ukrainian Crimea). And if there are any Russians in the Ukraine who don't like it then they should quite simply go back home to Russia were they belong. If I was in France and didn't like the way it was governed I wouldn't expect the UK Armed forces to invade France and declare it part of the UK. LOL
The west and NATO's response to what Putin has done in Ukraine is absolutely pathetic! You can't appease people like Putin or he'll just take more and more.... We should've called his bluff. He's just a lying corrupt power hungry little Hitler!
It's not so "simple" when you consider that the anti-government protests in Ukraine were led by Nazists ::)
Dangerous nationalists, anti-semitic, that surely don't like and protect minorities ( like the russian-speaking ones ); and supported by part of the right-wing of the US: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/15/john-mccain-ukraine-protests-support-just-cause
Things are not so black and white, uh? :-\
I agree, it's not so black and white as I was talking above, and the Ukranian government should've done more to crack down on the Nazi supporters hassling the Russian population. But still, that doesn't give Putin the right to invade Ukrainian sovereign territory and do a land grab. Also the Ukranian people had a right to decide their own destiny and I suspect that the Nazi's were only a small minority of those that wanted Ukraine to join Europe and NATO. Same as the Nazi supporters in UK, they make a big noise but in reality they are a relatively very small group of idiots.
As for American right-wing supporting the Nazi's - I don't think they were supporting the Nazi's, I mean by god that wouldn't go down very well in the USA, McCain would be strung up hung drawn and quartered for supporting Nazi's..... The Americans were just supporting the Ukranian peoples right to self determination.
Hawk.
Quote from: BOBR6 84 on September 18, 2014, 11:09:45 PM
Lol sadly I agree.. No matter who is in power they all say one thing to get there, then do the same as the party before when they do.
UKIP are popular now because they vow to cap immigration! Thats all I care about at the moment..
The fact is though.. Conservative vowed to tackle that issue too. They wont stand up to the EU though!
Besides it makes the rich even richer so why would they?
I agree.... So it's time to vote for a totally different party to govern the UK. UKIP get my vote, simply because they will get us out of Europe. It's not that I'm against European people or countries, but the EU bureaucrats are getting too big for their boots... The EU was initially created for making trade between the EU member countries free and easy; now they want to dictate a sovereign countries policy on what countries can and cannot do in law and within their own borders; to me that's when the EU lost my support.
But I guess the usual dumbo's who vote with family and party tradition will win the day as usual.. so those people deserve the political party and type of Gov they vote for and shouldn't complain when things go wrong. It's time for a big change from the main three parties, so let's give UKIP a chance. ;D
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 07:31:34 PM
As for Scotland. No surprise really but I think they're going to bottle it..
grT ;D
Lol.... It's looking like you were correct Tracey. ;)
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:46:41 PM
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 07:31:34 PM
As for Scotland. No surprise really but I think they're going to bottle it..
grT ;D
Lol.... It's looking like you were correct Tracey. ;)
Hawk.
Lol yep ;D
David cameron is lucky in 2 ways!
Days of old the person responsible for loosing parts of the monarchs sovereignty would be sent to the tower of london To be tortured!
Lovely! Bring it back ;D bunch of tossers lol
Unofficial results have it NO vote winning!
Have scottland really thought this through haha
What about the british army and special forces? If we split wouldnt all the scottish soldiers be kicked out?
How would that work I wonder?
NHS hospitals! Would they simply belong to scotland?
EU. They joined as part of britain! Would they have to re-apply? They wouldnt stand a chance until they built their own econemy up surely?
What about all the scotts living all over the uk? Would they have to go back and apply for residence?
Huge task!
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:28:01 PM
I agree, it's not so black and white as I was talking above, and the Ukranian government should've done more to crack down on the Nazi supporters hassling the Russian population. But still, that doesn't give Putin the right to invade Ukrainian sovereign territory and do a land grab. Also the Ukranian people had a right to decide their own destiny and I suspect that the Nazi's were only a small minority of those that wanted Ukraine to join Europe and NATO. Same as the Nazi supporters in UK, they make a big noise but in reality they are a relatively very small group of idiots.
Precisely when and how did Putin invade any territory within the Ukraine? Can anybody provide a date when the tanks rolled over the border?
Russia and the Ukraine had a decade's old joint defence agreement which allowed up to 25,000 Russian military and naval personal to be present in the Ukraine at any one time. Russia's crucially important Black Sea port, at Sevastopol, remained the location of the Russian Black Sea Fleet right up to the present day. Hardly an invasion.
What land-grab? The people of the Crimea, under extremely difficult and dangerous circumstances following the U.S. and Western backed coup d'etat in Kiev by far right nationalist and Neo-Nazi factions quite understandably, bearing in mind the people of the Crimea are overwhelming ethnic Russian in origin, voted for the Crimea to accede to the Russian Federation. This was done peaceably and democratically. Unlike the illegal Western backed coup d'etat in Kiev which violently toppled the democratically elected government of Viktor Yanukovych.
The point is that the illegitimate "Ukrainian government" post coup d'etat was comprised of a number of leading figures from the far right and nationalist parties within the Ukraine. These individuals held high office within the Ukrainian Coalition. Why would they crack down on themselves?
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:28:01 PM
As for American right-wing supporting the Nazi's - I don't think they were supporting the Nazi's, I mean by god that wouldn't go down very well in the USA, McCain would be strung up hung drawn and quartered for supporting Nazi's..... The Americans were just supporting the Ukranian peoples right to self determination.
Of course Victoria Nuland et al at the State Department in Washington were supporting known Neo-Nazis in the Ukraine. That is accepted fact not theory. The U.S. state Department have also knowingly been supporting and funding Islamic Extremists in Libya & Syria. Why? Because it suits their geo-political agenda to do so. The irony of course is that until recently if one was situated in Syria, as a Islamic Rebel fighter, then the U.S. State Department funded and armed you and saw you as an ally. If said Islamic Fighter crossed the border with his U.S. supplied weaponry into Iraq and became a fighter for ISIS he suddenly became the enemy of the U.S. and the West..
My view is that what is going on in the the Ukraine is a proxy war being fought for geo-politcal reasons. The motives of the EU and the West seem to have little to do with supporting the Ukrainian people's right to self-determination. I think that's just a cover for what is actually going on in the Ukraine. Also whilst talking of people's rights to self-determination does not such a concept apply to the people of the Crimea?
For me there is a parallel between what is going on in the Ukraine and the Cuban Missile Crisis. There is now a very real possibility of nuclear missiles being sited at some point of time in the future on Ukrainian soil. If the Ukraine does in the future become part of NATO. So U.S. missiles could potentially be sited right on Russia's borders. Just think back to the nuclear stand-off that took place in the early 1960's when Russia placed missiles on the Island of Cuba. People actually began to think the unthinkable that this could herald the end of the world. Until JFK and Khrushchev sorted things out via the hotline from Russia to Moscow for the good of humanity. Now the same prospect is facing Russia.. This is insane!
So much for the promise made to Gorbachev at the time of the dismantlement of the Soviet Union in 1990 that there would be no further NATO expansion Eastwards. That promise has been broken long ago. The encirclement of Russia by NATO continues.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/nato-s-eastward-expansion-did-the-west-break-its-promise-to-moscow-a-663315.html
I would just like to say I do not feel that I am biased either way on these issues. I honestly just try to reach an impartial viewpoint courtesy of the independent press and independent news outlets. I have pretty much given up on the mainstream media if I am honest. I would also like to think that I am also not a conspiracy theorist. At the end of the day however everyone should be free to voice their opinions and views on these important matters without censure. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Sometimes people just have to politely agree to disagree I think. ;) Bottom line for me is that I just don't want the world to end prematurely..! :) I would very much like to sample a finished version of gpbikes before the unthinkable happens..!
Back on topic I notice the result in Scotland is in the negative. I have to say I am not that surprised if I am absolutely honest. I would have been quite shocked if the United Kingdom had shrunk dramatically this morning.
grT :)
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:40:28 PM
UKIP get my vote, simply because they will get us out of Europe.
As if UK has ever been really part of EU ... the UK contribution to the whole EU debate sums up to bragging about this or that economical policy (most of the time disputing something to France).
For sure I've not heard a lot from the UK when the subject was the fight against tax heavens ...
Again, I'm not a big fan of the current EU, but if you join you join, you don't half-join or a quarter-join ... too easy.
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 18, 2014, 07:31:34 PM
As for Scotland. No surprise really but I think they're going to bottle it..
grT ;D
I guess we have a winner here :)
MaX.
P.S.
Now wait a second ... Piboso, you nasty manipulator ... you threw this bomb in the forum just to distract us from the only real and capital question: when is beta6 coming out ? ;D
@Tracey: Okay... Putin may not have blatantly invaded the Ukraine, but he certainly did it by proxy using his soldiers as mercenaries and Russian weaponry and supplies to back them up. Only yesterday there was a poor Russian soldiers mother saying that her Russian soldier son had been ordered to go and fight in the Ukraine in an unofficial status(as a mercenary), so in effect Putin did invade the Ukraine but did it in a way that was difficult for the political world to react against. Putin knew very well what he was doing....
As for the Crimean populations right to self determination - Well yes of course they should have the right to self determination, but certainly not have the right become part of Russia; and Putin should have told them that it's not Russia's place to adopt the Crimean peninsular as part of Russia, that they have to govern themselves. Besides that, the likelihood of the poll being unbiased and uncorrupted in that kind of volatile environment are very slim indeed, so you have to ask yourself, "Was is really a true representation of the Crimean people?", their must have been so many non-Russian people who were just too afraid to go and vote against the violent masses at the time.
I guess all countries play the game of geo-politics and support their enemies to attain a geo political objective. Overall this shows us all just how far away we are from a united world of peace... Maybe in another thousand years we will have reached a mental maturity that will allow world peace and harmony to happen.... That is if we don't destroy ourselves in the meantime.
To be honest, if I was the Gods(extra-terrestrials), I would wipe the slate clean and start their experiment all over again. They must be very disappointed with their work, or else I can only imagine they are having a good laugh at our stupidity. Lol
Hawk.
PS: Do you write novels for a living? ;D
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
P.S.
Now wait a second ... Piboso, you nasty manipulator ... you threw this bomb in the forum just to distract us from the only real and capital question: when is beta6 coming out ? ;D
Now that is something i am very interested in ;D Piboso you utter bastered ;)
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:40:28 PM
UKIP get my vote, simply because they will get us out of Europe.
As if UK has ever been really part of EU ... the UK contribution to the whole EU debate sums up to bragging about this or that economical policy (most of the time disputing something to France).
For sure I've not heard a lot from the UK when the subject was the fight against tax heavens ...
Doesn't everyone dispute against the French over EU laws? LOL.
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
Again, I'm not a big fan of the current EU, but if you join you join, you don't half-join or a quarter-join ... too easy.
The EU is slowing but surely stripping it's members of their sovereign right to govern their own countries
We joined when the EU was just supposed to make trading easier between the EU members, not to have some jumped up dicks in Brussels tell us what we can and cannot do within our own sovereign borders that has nothing to do with EU trading.
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
P.S.
Now wait a second ... Piboso, you nasty manipulator ... you threw this bomb in the forum just to distract us from the only real and capital question: when is beta6 coming out ? ;D
Lol ;D
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:06:06 AM
PS: Do you write novels for a living? ;D
LOL! Well unfortunately no one pays me for this verbiage. I don't think they ever would either.. ;)
But no joking apart this is a very interesting subject and it is pleasing that we can discuss such serious issues without falling out with each other.
As a parting shot all I would say is that Putin is of course defending Russia's interests. And Russia has long established and extremely important strategical interests in the Crimea. What would the U.S.A. do if faced with the same dilemma? Also look at the fate of the ethnic Russians in the East of the Ukraine..and its not over yet. A lucky escape for the inhabitants of the Crimea in so many ways. The Director of the CIA is making quite regular trips to Kiev so one might argue that interference in the Ukraine's affairs works both ways..
But all this is conveniently ignoring the elephant in the room in my view. The reason I feel the Ukrainian crisis exists, just as the crisis in the Middle East exists, is not really about the crises in the M.E. or the Ukraine..it is because the entire Western financial system is in a state of near collapse.
The West seeing that the Eurasian nations, in particular Russia, China and India, through the BRICS process, through the new "Silk Road", through collaboration with Latin America, with Africa is creating an entirely new & predominant economic system. Based upon harmony of interests, based on development of nuclear power and based upon trade in all important commodities. Including oil and gas. This development and this peaceful collaboration of nations is seen as a danger to the Western stratus quo & the incumbent dollar financial system. My real fear is that there are those in positions of power and influence in the West who are willing to go to war rather than allowing a new world economic order to come into being. Scary as the prospect is that is what I personally believe we are now seeing being played out on the world stage.
Anyway, I'll shut-up now. ;D
What is clear with regard to Scotland is how divided on this fundamentally important issue the Scots are. I imagine there are many disappointed souls in Scotland this morning.. But the decision has been made and the decision must be respected by all concerned I guess.
grT :)
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
P.S.
Now wait a second ... Piboso, you nasty manipulator ... you threw this bomb in the forum just to distract us from the only real and capital question: when is beta6 coming out ? ;D
;D
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 19, 2014, 09:35:31 AM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:06:06 AM
PS: Do you write novels for a living? ;D
LOL! Well unfortunately no one pays me for this verbiage. I don't think they ever would either.. ;)
But no joking apart this is a very interesting subject and it is pleasing that we can discuss such serious issues without falling out with each other.
As a parting shot all I would say is that Putin is of course defending Russia's interests. And Russia has long established and extremely important strategical interests in the Crimea. What would the U.S.A. do if faced with the same dilemma? Also look at the fate of the ethnic Russians in the East of the Ukraine..and its not over yet. A lucky escape for the inhabitants of the Crimea in so many ways. The Director of the CIA is making quite regular trips to Kiev so one might argue that interference in the Ukraine's affairs works both ways..
But all this is conveniently ignoring the elephant in the room in my view. The reason I feel the Ukrainian crisis exists, just as the crisis in the Middle East exists, is not really about the crises in the M.E. or the Ukraine..it is because the entire Western financial system is in a state of near collapse.
The West seeing that the Eurasian nations, in particular Russia, China and India, through the BRICS process, through the new "Silk Road", through collaboration with Latin America, with Africa is creating an entirely new & predominant economic system. Based upon harmony of interests, based on development of nuclear power and based upon trade in all important commodities. Including oil and gas. This development and this peaceful collaboration of nations is seen as a danger to the Western stratus quo & the incumbent dollar financial system. My real fear is that there are those in positions of power and influence in the West who are willing to go to war rather than allowing a new world economic order to come into being. Scary as the prospect is that is what I personally believe we are now seeing being played out on the world stage.
Anyway, I'll shut-up now. ;D
What is clear with regard to Scotland is how divided on this fundamentally important issue the Scots are. I imagine there are many disappointed souls in Scotland this morning.. But the decision has been made and the decision must be respected by all concerned I guess.
grT :)
What your saying there does make sense(if that's the right word?).
I hate to say this, but maybe a final world war is our destiny to pave the way for a stable world order that can move us on into the future? It will be a hard lesson, but one that maybe has to happen to allow the changes that are needed?
What a complicated world we live in, eh.
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 18, 2014, 11:40:28 PM
UKIP get my vote, simply because they will get us out of Europe.
As if UK has ever been really part of EU ... the UK contribution to the whole EU debate sums up to bragging about this or that economical policy (most of the time disputing something to France).
For sure I've not heard a lot from the UK when the subject was the fight against tax heavens ...
Doesn't everyone dispute against the French over EU laws? LOL.
No, not everyone. It's mostly the british, dunno why :)
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 06:37:47 AM
Again, I'm not a big fan of the current EU, but if you join you join, you don't half-join or a quarter-join ... too easy.
The EU is slowing but surely stripping it's members of their sovereign right to govern their own countries
Which is normal: when you decide to join a thing like the EU, you know from the start that you'll delegate some decisions/power. That's not the problem.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
We joined when the EU was just supposed to make trading easier between the EU members,
You see ? This is why I say that UK (and england in particular) is ultra-liberal.
If the only thing you see in the EU is easier trading (and that seems to be the UK view on EU), then you should NOT be in the EU in the first place.
MaX.
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 01:18:24 PM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
We joined when the EU was just supposed to make trading easier between the EU members,
You see ? This is why I say that UK (and england in particular) is ultra-liberal.
If the only thing you see in the EU is easier trading (and that seems to be the UK view on EU), then you should NOT be in the EU in the first place.
MaX.
The EU was "initially" setup for ease of trade only and that's why we joined. Now they think they have the right to dictate what a sovereign country can and cannot do in law. That is were they are out of order, and our Gov doesn't seem to want to stop this ruling behaviour..... So now it's time to leave the EU. Simple, and that is what will happen... and we'll take our £55,000,000.00 a day with us to spend on better things than paying for a new EU Parliament building and EU members of parliament corrupt expense claims(What!? During the middle of a financial crisis!!??? C'mon... Pricks!). Amazing how quite they are about the expenses corruption isn't it, but then they'll say that they are doing nothing wrong as the rules allow them to to it! Haha... What a bunch of dicks politicians are..... "We're in this all together" they told us.... Yeah right... Don't make me laugh! Lol :P
Okay... Stepping off my soapbox now. ;D
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 02:11:29 PM
Quote from: HornetMaX on September 19, 2014, 01:18:24 PM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:24:58 AM
We joined when the EU was just supposed to make trading easier between the EU members,
You see ? This is why I say that UK (and england in particular) is ultra-liberal.
If the only thing you see in the EU is easier trading (and that seems to be the UK view on EU), then you should NOT be in the EU in the first place.
MaX.
The EU was "initially" setup for ease of trade only and that's why we joined. Now they think they have the right to dictate what a sovereign country can and cannot do in law. That is were they are out of order, and our Gov doesn't seem to want to stop this ruling behaviour..... So now it's time to leave the EU. Simple, and that is what will happen... and we'll take our £55,000,000.00 a day with us to spend on better things than paying for a new EU Parliament building and EU members of parliament corrupt expense claims(What!? During the middle of a financial crisis!!??? C'mon... Pricks!). Amazing how quite they are about the expenses corruption isn't it, but then they'll say that they are doing nothing wrong as the rules allow them to to it! Haha... What a bunch of dicks politicians are..... "We're in this all together" they told us.... Yeah right... Don't make me laugh! Lol :P
I may agree with your judgment on politicians, but you're wrong in the fundamental goals of the EU. It has never been "for ease of trade only", economics were only a part of the deal.
MaX.
Was the United Kingdom taken into the E.U. illegally though? Some legal experts would contend that our membership of the E.U. is invalid and violated U.K. law and was "constitutionally" unsound.
Just thought I would stir things up by saying that.. ;D
http://www.vernoncoleman.com/euillegally.html
Well Politicians are proving yet again that they are lying cheating b*stards... Seems they are already laying the ground for reneging on their promises to the Scottish people now they've won the referendum. >:(
@Max As far as I remember, and I am old enough to remember this, that the main reason the UK public wanted to joined the EU in 1973 was simply because of the benefits of the "Common Market"; that's what the campaign was promoted on and why the UK public voted to join, though this was probably another geo political lie from the Govnt. ::)
But it seems to me that the EU's intention is to eventually take total control of the EU and eventually govern all EU countries from the EU parliament in Brussels? So while we're having referendums why don't we just hold a referendum to see if the EU countries will forfeit all sovereign control to the EU parliament? Lol...... I'm sure you'd soon find out the real reason people join the EU, and I guarantee it isn't for wanting the EU dictating the laws of EU countries like they are trying to do more and more as time goes by..... It's obvious what there aim is over time, and if they were sensible about the laws they make then I'd fully support it because I'm all for an eventual one world government, but a European government that is obviously full of idiots is certainly not what I'm going to vote for. :P
Hawk.
Quote from: girlracerTracey on September 19, 2014, 03:44:21 PM
Was the United Kingdom taken into the E.U. illegally though? Some legal experts would contend that our membership of the E.U. is invalid and violated U.K. law and was "constitutionally" unsound.
Just thought I would stir things up by saying that.. ;D
http://www.vernoncoleman.com/euillegally.html
Haha!! That would not surprise me at all Tracey. Sounds about right... Politicians do as they please to suit there agenda at the time and we have to suffer the consequences for decades afterwards. Lol
I give up! Let chaos rain! Hehe. ;D
Hawk.
[/quote]
What your saying there does make sense(if that's the right word?).
I hate to say this, but maybe a final world war is our destiny to pave the way for a stable world order that can move us on into the future? It will be a hard lesson, but one that maybe has to happen to allow the changes that are needed?
What a complicated world we live in, eh.
Hawk.
[/quote]
We have had 2 world war and the mentaly has been changed a little, but not much, the problem is at first : the money, or all those who want more and more money
At second: we dońt remember what happened in the past and we dont take lesson for the futur.
At third: many people around the world work from many years ago to tell the people what they need to know about our humanity past.
At fourth: the winners ever wright the story like they want.
Quote from: janaucarre on September 19, 2014, 04:13:46 PM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 09:06:06 AM
What your saying there does make sense(if that's the right word?).
I hate to say this, but maybe a final world war is our destiny to pave the way for a stable world order that can move us on into the future? It will be a hard lesson, but one that maybe has to happen to allow the changes that are needed?
What a complicated world we live in, eh.
Hawk.
We have had 2 world war and the mentaly has been changed a little, but not much, the problem is at first : the money, or all those who want more and more money
At second: we dońt remember what happened in the past and we dont take lesson for the futur.
At third: many people around the world work from many years ago to tell the people what they need to know about our humanity past.
At fourth: the winners ever wright the story like they want.
Very true Janau.... But how do we get these power hungry political idiots to move us on into the future and stop believing that money is the be all and end all of existence?
While we continue using this monetary economical system of control we will never progress to were we need to be before it's too late. I mean the Earths resources are not limitless the are finite.
I also wonder how the world governments would react if a massive meteor was discovered on a direct impact with Earth? Would the world come together to attempt a solution or would they say it costs too much and keep arguing with each other until it's too late? I suspect the later. So maybe a disaster that collapses the world economical system would be a hard lesson to learn but good for our long term future?
Hawk.
I couldn't agree more, trouble is brewing and yes war is never a good thing but us human beings we seem to be our own worst enemy. Some chaos could help get rid of the shit (politicians I mean). It's simple, to start again and make a better world we need to get rid of that bad, greedy and evil blood.
New way of life- ( let's work together to better mankind and money has no meaning)....Star trek here we come.
Quote from: Toomes1 on September 19, 2014, 04:44:06 PM
I couldn't agree more, trouble is brewing and yes war is never a good thing but us human beings we seem to be our own worst enemy. Some chaos could help get rid of the shit (politicians I mean). It's simple, to start again and make a better world we need to get rid of that bad, greedy and evil blood.
New way of life- ( let's work together to better mankind and money has no meaning)....Star trek here we come.
+10000%
Well said Toomes!.... Now that's the kind of world we should all aspire to aim for! ;D 8) 8)
Hawk.
In our story, big disasters happened and maked almost the total destruction of human race, and we are here, hehe:)
The time clears all bad things, and sometimes good things.
Watch our story, in the story books, what are the most common things?
War, war, war, and war ever. Sometimes a guy come with a revolutionnary idea that can help all the world, like Tesla, de vinci, etc... And what happens? Their ideas are used by the army or are hidden.
The new technologies for the wellfare, for example one person has lost his leggs or anything else, or one is born without view or without hearing, what happens?
The first use of that kind of good technologies is for the army, at first for having better soldiers and beeing more powered to kill the enemies.
I like my world, we have one and only one.
I live in a country wich is taked as an example for many other countries but there is many, MANY, problems that i really don't like. For example: if you live under a bridge all along the years, as a tramp, your liability increase at about 3000 euros per year.
The cops arresting a tramp take all the money he has in his pocket.
Now i stop.
Perhaps one day and hawk just wanted to say thanks to yourself and Klax, just need to get back to him with few details. Cheers
Quote from: janaucarre on September 19, 2014, 04:56:11 PM
In our story, big disasters happened and maked almost the total destruction of human race, and we are here, hehe:)
The time clears all bad things, and sometimes good things.
Watch our story, in the story books, what are the most common things?
War, war, war, and war ever. Sometimes a guy come with a revolutionnary idea that can help all the world, like Tesla, de vinci, etc... And what happens? Their ideas are used by the army or are hidden.
The new technologies for the wellfare, for example one person has lost his leggs or anything else, or one is born without view or without hearing, what happens?
The first use of that kind of good technologies is for the army, at first for having better soldiers and beeing more powered to kill the enemies.
I like my world, we have one and only one.
I live in a country wich is taked as an example for many other countries but there is many, MANY, problems that i really don't like. For example: if you live under a bridge all along the years, as a tramp, your liability increase at about 3000 euros per year.
The cops arresting a tramp take all the money he has in his pocket.
Now i stop.
Very true
Quote from: Toomes1 on September 19, 2014, 04:57:00 PM
Perhaps one day and hawk just wanted to say thanks to yourself and Klax, just need to get back to him with few details. Cheers
Hi Toomes.
No problem mate.... Welcome to the team! ;D 8)
Hawk. ;)
PS: +1 Janau ;)
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 04:06:29 PM
@Max As far as I remember, and I am old enough to remember this, that the main reason the UK public wanted to joined the EU in 1973 was simply because of the benefits of the "Common Market"; that's what the campaign was promoted on and why the UK public voted to join, though this was probably another geo political lie from the Govnt. ::)
If it was in 73, then you didn't vote for EU, but for what came before that (e.g. the EEC), which was indeed an almost purely economical agreement.
But the EU is something else, much broader.
Quote from: Hawk_UK on September 19, 2014, 04:06:29 PM
But it seems to me that the EU's intention is to eventually take total control of the EU and eventually govern all EU countries from the EU parliament in Brussels?
I have no problem with that, as far as the government in Brussels acts in the interest of the entire community (and is elected in a democratic manner, of course).
Of course it's not the case right now, most of the time because each individual state looks only at his own domestic interest (domestic in the sense of his own domestic economy, people do not count, domestic or not).
MaX.