Bike Physics settings:
When increasing the RPM range on the "Auto-Clutch" to get a decent standing start it is effecting the strength of the "Engine Brake" too...... Surely we should be able to alter one without affecting the other?
Any ideas anyone?
Hawk.
well, i noticed something similar .. i think. If you use the engine brake on the 500 rsw, you should NOT downshift all the gears ... I used to trailbrake into a corner with a high gear (more engine brake) and shiftet down while releasing the brake (short before turning for the apex) ... hard to describe. I noticed something like a brake delay ... like the clutch is slipping trough and the engine brake doesnt take effect ...
well, did you get what i mean? :P
~doN
Quote from: doNico on November 06, 2015, 11:30:12 PM
well, i noticed something similar .. i think. If you use the engine brake on the 500 rsw, you should NOT downshift all the gears ... I used to trailbrake into a corner with a high gear (more engine brake) and shiftet down while releasing the brake (short before turning for the apex) ... hard to describe. I noticed something like a brake delay ... like the clutch is slipping trough and the engine brake doesnt take effect ...
well, did you get what i mean? :P
~doN
Must admit I haven't noticed that on the RSW500, but I don't use rear brakes right now. :-\
I know there has been issues on bikes before(I think it's a bike physics issue rather than a GPB programme issue), were when trying to change down gears while applying the rear brakes was difficult and delayed if not sometimes impossible..... Is this what you mean?
If this is something your experiencing it would be a good idea to post about the issue on the forum thread were the bike was released; then the bike physics authors can note it and take a look at the issue. :)
Personally I don't use rear brakes because of my controller button functionality - I use a joystick and don't have another analogue stick/trigger axis to use for rear brakes.
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk on November 06, 2015, 07:08:23 PM
Bike Physics settings:
When increasing the RPM range on the "Auto-Clutch" to get a decent standing start it is effecting the strength of the "Engine Brake" too...... Surely we should be able to alter one without affecting the other?
Not sure I understand what you mean here. Where are you "increasing the RPM range on the auto-clutch" ?
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 07, 2015, 09:03:07 AM
Quote from: Hawk on November 06, 2015, 07:08:23 PM
Bike Physics settings:
When increasing the RPM range on the "Auto-Clutch" to get a decent standing start it is effecting the strength of the "Engine Brake" too...... Surely we should be able to alter one without affecting the other?
Not sure I understand what you mean here. Where are you "increasing the RPM range on the auto-clutch" ?
Yes it's the auto-clutch. When we raise the RPM range to get good standing starts using the auto-clutch it badly effects the Engine braking(reduces it to 2 stroke levels).
Any ideas Max? :)
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk on November 08, 2015, 12:10:15 AM
Yes it's the auto-clutch. When we raise the RPM range to get good standing starts using the auto-clutch it badly effects the Engine braking(reduces it to 2 stroke levels).
Cause the hardcore-sim gang is using auto-clutch ? What's next ? Auto-shift ? You deceive me Hawk ... :)
OK, jokes aside, I can't help too much but I'd say that if you raise the auto-clutch RPM range too much, you arrive into ranges that are used not only when starting from stand, but also while riding. So interference is to be expected.
On my side, no auto-clutch: problem solved :)
MaX.
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 02:40:52 PM
Quote from: Hawk on November 08, 2015, 12:10:15 AM
Yes it's the auto-clutch. When we raise the RPM range to get good standing starts using the auto-clutch it badly effects the Engine braking(reduces it to 2 stroke levels).
Cause the hardcore-sim gang is using auto-clutch ? What's next ? Auto-shift ? You deceive me Hawk ... :)
OK, jokes aside, I can't help too much but I'd say that if you raise the auto-clutch RPM range too much, you arrive into ranges that are used not only when starting from stand, but also while riding. So interference is to be expected.
On my side, no auto-clutch: problem solved :)
MaX.
Hahaha..... No deceptions Max. Lol ;D
We're talking about modding bikes, so if it's supposed to work then it needs to work to be functional for those that use it, right? ;D
But how can the setting for the auto-clutch interfere with the Engine Brake? Seems to me something is not right in the programme logic there?
To say it's expected with the RPM range to start a bike with auto-clutch from a standing start just doesn't make sense to me. That's like saying that producing the RPM to make a manual clutch standing start is expected to interfere with the engine brake. Would you buy a bike that did that? I don't think so. Lol
Hawk.
well, i noticed it on every bike ...just try to not downshift and use the brake as long as you can ... try to shift down while turning for the corner.
~doN
How much did you raise the auto-clutch range ?
The whole auto-clutch thing is a cheapo workaround for people unable to use a manual clutch: it's not supposed to allow you to do flash starts at the green light ...
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 04:34:50 PM
How much did you raise the auto-clutch range ?
The whole auto-clutch thing is a cheapo workaround for people unable to use a manual clutch: it's not supposed to allow you to do flash starts at the green light ...
If I remember rightly it was a range of 3000 - 9000RPM for Auto-Clutch.
Well I disagree with the attitude that the auto-clutch is a cheap workaround therefore no need for it to work properly. How would you feel if you the electric starter didn't work on your bike and the mechanic said to you that starters are a lazy peoples way to start an engine so we didn't bother to fix it; Use the kick starter instead. Hehe ;D
Your correct. The auto-clutch isn't to allow for flash starts, but a basic auto-clutch(which this one is) can never replace the manual control of a race start a human can bring to it anyway. But an auto-clutch that does a reasonable job of starting from stand still is more than acceptable. Some bikes are just pathetic when trying to get the bike moving from a stand still using the auto-clutch; it's like the auto-clutch is used on an engine with the power of a lawnmower engine. Lol. :P
This should be a problem the bike physics modders can sort out without it affecting the engine brake in my opinion. But above all surely it shows something wrong in, as I've said above, the programme logic?
Hawk.
9000RPM, way too much (I don't even need to ask for which bike it was, it's too much for any of them).
I don't know how it's implemented exactly, but I'd sat that you're trying to make the auto-clutch thing do something it's not designed to do.
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 05:27:38 PM
9000RPM, way too much (I don't even need to ask for which bike it was, it's too much for any of them).
I don't know how it's implemented exactly, but I'd sat that you're trying to make the auto-clutch thing do something it's not designed to do.
A max RPM of 9000RPM when slipping the clutch - Too much?! Are you kidding me? I've slipped a clutch a lot higher than that before when making a race start. Lol
Hawk
Quote from: Hawk on November 08, 2015, 05:33:42 PM
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 05:27:38 PM
9000RPM, way too much (I don't even need to ask for which bike it was, it's too much for any of them).
I don't know how it's implemented exactly, but I'd sat that you're trying to make the auto-clutch thing do something it's not designed to do.
A max RPM of 9000RPM when slipping the clutch - Too much?! Are you kidding me? I've slipped a clutch a lot higher than that before when making a race start. Lol
Too much for the auto-clutch, not to get a good start manually (which of course involves slipping the clutch at high rpms).
Again, the auto-clutch is not designed to give you a decent start, but only to avoid stalling the engine. You're trying to make it do something it can't.
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 06:32:07 PM
Quote from: Hawk on November 08, 2015, 05:33:42 PM
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 08, 2015, 05:27:38 PM
9000RPM, way too much (I don't even need to ask for which bike it was, it's too much for any of them).
I don't know how it's implemented exactly, but I'd sat that you're trying to make the auto-clutch thing do something it's not designed to do.
A max RPM of 9000RPM when slipping the clutch - Too much?! Are you kidding me? I've slipped a clutch a lot higher than that before when making a race start. Lol
Too much for the auto-clutch, not to get a good start manually (which of course involves slipping the clutch at high rpms).
Again, the auto-clutch is not designed to give you a decent start, but only to avoid stalling the engine. You're trying to make it do something it can't.
Then it needs redesigning to give a decent start(note were not talking about giving a good race start here); just to get any bike running along again within 3-4 secs would be great.
But above all it should not effect the operation of the engine brake. This is what I cannot fathom out? Surely a bug? ::)
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk on November 08, 2015, 11:37:19 PM
But above all it should not effect the operation of the engine brake. This is what I cannot fathom out? Surely a bug? ::)
I think that if you've set the auto-clutch upper limit at 9000RPM, each time your RPM fall below that, the clutch will disengage progressively, from fully engaged at 9000RPM to fully disengaged at your auto-clutch lower RPM limit. So you lose your engine brake because you're actually using the clutch.
@Hawk
Could you please upload you video (1:18-1:28). Not the whole only the mentioned timerange.
I think MAX is right.
Quote from: C21 on November 09, 2015, 09:06:00 AM
@Hawk
Could you please upload you video (1:18-1:28). Not the whole only the mentioned timerange.
I think MAX is right.
Best thing to do to save video editing would be for me to just provide the download link for the whole video and then I'm sure Max can scoot along to the time frames you mentioned. It's not that big a file. :)
I'll be out all day, but I'll post the link this evening for you, Max. :)
Hawk.
Quote from: Hawk on November 09, 2015, 09:15:14 AM
Quote from: C21 on November 09, 2015, 09:06:00 AM
@Hawk
Could you please upload you video (1:18-1:28). Not the whole only the mentioned timerange.
I think MAX is right.
Best thing to do to save video editing would be for me to just provide the download link for the whole video and then I'm sure Max can scoot along to the time frames you mentioned. It's not that big a file. :)
I'll be out all day, but I'll post the link this evening for you, Max. :)
I agree, especially on the "max is right" part :)
Notice that the auto-clutch lower RPM limit should be somewhere below/close to the idle RPM: it doesn't make sense to have the auto-clutch lower limit to 8000RPM.
Send the video (link) and the details of your bike: idle RPM, auto-cluth lower and upper limit.
Just looked at the video (thanks Hawk), it's I said: as soon the enginee goes below 9000rpm the clutch starts to disengage (visible in the debug, two vertical blue bars).
Below 8000rpm the clutch is fully disengaged: with throttle off, the engine goes to idle.
There's no bug, you can't raise the auto-clutch upper limit that much (and the lower limit should stay low, a bit below the idle rpms).
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 09, 2015, 05:22:05 PM
Just looked at the video (thanks Hawk), it's I said: as soon the enginee goes below 9000rpm the clutch starts to disengage (visible in the debug, two vertical blue bars).
Below 8000rpm the clutch is fully disengaged: with throttle off, the engine goes to idle.
There's no bug, you can't raise the auto-clutch upper limit that much (and the lower limit should stay low, a bit below the idle rpms).
No probs Max. ;)
It just makes it terrible for getting started with low powered bikes using auto clutch alone. It takes ages to get the bike moving forward and the rpm into the power-band. It may not be a bug but it is a design flaw surely given that an auto-clutch should be able to start any bike running at a reasonable pace(again we are not talking about a race start pace here). :)
Just have to accept it for now and hope Piboso will take a look at it for a future update. :)
Thanks for taking a look at that Max. ;) 8)
Hawk
start using manual clutch, hawk.
you can also use it when the rear steps out too much under braking.
Yeh bin all that Auto rubbish totally. In fact get rid of it from the game options lol :D
get a joystick with a analogue POV hat and lots of buttons ;D
or go for a full brain retrain 360 stylie ;)
Quote from: vin97 on November 09, 2015, 06:47:22 PM
start using manual clutch, hawk.
you can also use it when the rear steps out too much under braking.
I do use manual clutch guys! Hehe ;D
Our Mod Team is updating the M3 bikeMods. They are very weak on the auto-clutch start. Not that I use it personally, but if they are in-sim then I just like things to work properly. ;)
I'm sure if you scratched you bikes paintwork you'd like it sorted-out even though it has no reflection on your bikes performance, right? But I'm banging my head against a brick wall because everyone seems to be of the attitude to not bother fixing it..... I'm just thinking more about newbies.... I'm sure you guys can remember using the auto clutch at some stage when you first bought GPB? I see it being used a lot by newbies in races off the start grid. Often end up clattering someone else on the grid because of the poor auto-clutch performance. So yeah I do believe it needs to be sorted at some stage. :P ;D
But seems I'm a lone soldier on this one. :'( ;D
Hawk.
OOPS sorry Hawk. :-[
I am annoyed really because I already suspected that was your reason but only came in with a witty remark. Apologies.
Striving for perfection gets my vote mate. I would help if I had a fekin clue lol.
Solved ;D (not a 100% vote but a 90 :-\ )
Can be closed.
Quote from: Napalm Nick on November 09, 2015, 07:18:26 PM
OOPS sorry Hawk. :-[
I am annoyed really because I already suspected that was your reason but only came in with a witty remark. Apologies.
Striving for perfection gets my vote mate. I would help if I had a fekin clue lol.
No probs Nick! No need to apologise mate.... I enjoy your witty remarks! ;D
I'm sure Vin misunderstood the thread too, but no worries guys. Really. ;D
Hawk. 8)
Quote from: C21 on November 09, 2015, 07:33:17 PM
Solved ;D (not a 100% vote but a 90 :-\ )
Can be closed.
Solved as in you found a solution, or that the thread has come to a conclusion? ;D
Hawk.