I compared the 1st person view with the same settings (fov=75, pitch = 50) and to me there's too much difference between the murasama and, for example, the 916 and the nr750, see below.
(http://i.imgur.com/Hj8MTGn.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/VdRNbOF.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/FfKwhOb.jpg)
I see only two possible solutions:
- Modders try to harmonize their 1st person point of view to be similar (not necessarily identical) to the murasama.
- PiBoSo allows us to have the pitch setting tied to a bike (i.e. the pitch is saved per bike).
I'm not sure we'll ever get solution 2 (there may be good practical reasons for that), so ...
Or if we're convinced the murasama 1st person point of view is "bad", then we should try to harmonize across our mods.
I actually think Blacky's view to be better as when you sit on a bike you can actually see the top clamp and the top of the fork tubes.
I find the original 990 to be too low as if I was 8 ft tall.
Its just my thoughts but maybe a poll should be done or people should submit a screen capture so we can find out exactly how most have it for 1st person if they use it. Figures are only going to confuse the issue. A picture says a thousand words as they say.
Good idea to get it standardized though.
DD
The murasama view is good, but just for the... murasama model!
My mod has a huge cockpit and mirrors, this requires a different point of view (lower down). If also H put the mirrors on the model, he too should make my choice.
Imo it 'impossible an identical view for all bikes.
Good point Blacky. The road bikes with mirrors require a wider view as standard to implicate the mirrors.
Also, in real life, the height of a rider makes a big difference and I think it would be good to have the direct up and down of the view adjustable too not just the angle and FOV.
DD
I'd agree with what Blacky says: That the view would have to be different depending on the clock view of each bike, because a 1st person rider needs to be able to have all clocks in view in my opinon.
Hawk.
Gotta say it really is a fact that there are so many variables that to have ONE standard view would be hard.
As I said before, I think it would be better to have more view adjustability in the GPB menu which would maybe make it easier for the bike Modder.
DD
You don't get the point.
When you sit on a motogp bike or on a harley, you have the same fov, that depends on your eyes.
You are in a different position with respect to the dash, true. But the difference we have today is just too much across bikes that are roughly of the same category (sportbikes).
Then of course you may want to adjust the pitch (unless you have an head tracker, and maybe even when you have one), but for sure you shouldn't need a different fov across two bikes.
Another thing that is sometimes very different from a mod bike to another is the aspect of the 1st person view (how much horizontal space the bike takes): this seems to come from the fact that some other games (from which some bikes are "sourced") use a specific aspect factor for the 3d 1st person model.
Quote from: Hawk on May 06, 2016, 10:39:54 PM
I'd agree with what Blacky says: That the view would have to be different depending on the clock view of each bike, because a 1st person rider needs to be able to have all clocks in view in my opinon.
I for sure don't have my dash in view on my real bike: I need to look down with my eyes to see it (when riding normally, not tucked in). At best it's in the peripheral field.
That's why if you are a hardcore 1st person rider, you do need an head tracker :)
Quote from: HornetMaX on May 06, 2016, 11:02:42 PM
Quote from: Hawk on May 06, 2016, 10:39:54 PM
I'd agree with what Blacky says: That the view would have to be different depending on the clock view of each bike, because a 1st person rider needs to be able to have all clocks in view in my opinon.
I for sure don't have my dash in view on my real bike: I need to look down with my eyes to see it (when riding normally, not tucked in). At best it's in the peripheral field.
That's why if you are a hardcore 1st person rider, you do need an head tracker :)
I agree with that too Max, but seeing as majority don't use a head tracker then bike authors should set the view accordingly(better to be able to see the clocks than not see them at all), and besides, if people have and use a head tracker then the default view shouldn't bother them at all. :)
Hawk.
In my experience , when you ride fast on an R bike most time you don't see anything else than black tarmac ;D
Im my settings in GPB , i only see the top clamp when tucked in.
I don't think he can even see his hand :)
(http://www.lavanguardia.com/r/GODO/LV/p3/WebSite/2016/04/01/Recortada/518570774_20160401210931-kpaH-U40792659051y6C-992x558@LaVanguardia-Web.jpg)
I thought we were talking about while sitting still like in the pits (to get a reference point)not during riding as you are moving Warlock. Then as you say you see less of the bike.
DD
Quote from: Hawk on May 06, 2016, 11:30:36 PM
I agree with that too Max, but seeing as majority don't use a head tracker then bike authors should set the view accordingly(better to be able to see the clocks than not see them at all) and besides, if people have and use a head tracker then the default view shouldn't bother them at all. :)
That's the point where we disagree: even withuot head tracking, I don't think the default position of the POV should be such that you have the dash on the screen, because in reality it's not like that (on this kind of bikes).
Notice that if you do want to have the dash on screen (which is understandable), you can just change the pitch setting in-game. But what I'm saying is that in order to try to have the dash on screen with default settings (fov and pitch), we end up with the POV too low and close to the dash, which is probably bad.
Quote from: Warlock on May 07, 2016, 01:07:10 AM
In my experience , when you ride fast on an R bike most time you don't see anything else than black tarmac ;D
Im my settings in GPB , i only see the top clamp when tucked in.
I don't think he can even see his hand :)
Exactly.
I would prefer;
That the helmet cam correctly followed the riders horizontal and vertical view position with the 'pitch' allowing for personal adjustment of gauges or track. (commented on this somewhere when b8 was released)
The 'on bike' can then be positioned in the lower 1/3 of the screen or whatever is agreed is generally best for everyone.
Quote from: h106frp on May 07, 2016, 10:44:58 AM
I would prefer;
That the helmet cam correctly followed the riders horizontal and vertical view position with the 'pitch' allowing for personal adjustment of gauges or track. (commented on this somewhere when b8 was released)
But that's the case already, the 1st on-board cam moves with the rider movements, no ?
Not really, the camera is not locked to the helmet position but is adjusted for start position in BikeED - hence the variety in views. If you watch helmet view against a 3rd person replay you will observe it does not seem to track faithfully, when the rider has his head on the tank the camera will still be too high in 1P even if you set the start position low in BikeED.
Have a look at the camera positions in the models in BikeED compared to your screen shots - its difficult to correlate them but seems to be some combined position effect of the 2 separate cameras.
Quote from: h106frp on May 07, 2016, 11:56:22 AM
Not really, the camera is not locked to the helmet position but is adjusted for start position in BikeED - hence the variety in views. If you watch helmet view against a 3rd person replay you will observe it does not seem to track faithfully, when the rider has his head on the tank the camera will still be too high in 1P even if you set the start position low in BikeED.
I wouldn't use replays to judge that as we know that the onboard cam in replays does not match the onboard cam while riding (and that's unfortunate, but that's another topic).
To me the 1st rider cam move with the rider: it moves fwd/back when the rider tucks in and it moves laterally when the bike leans (this is trickier, as what you see is in fact the bike swinging below the camera). So after that it should just be a matter of positioning the camera correctly. I'm not sure, what's the obstacle here ?
V0.5 of NR750 had the very best camera position and fov. v0.6 isn't as good. I haven't had a problem with any of the other bikes, so perhaps the 750's the only one.
I don't agree. I think the setting should be at its best with the default setting then users can tweak it as they like. You set it with just about maximum FoV and pitch if I recall?
+1 Nick
DD
Quote from: Urban Chaos 2.0 on May 09, 2016, 12:13:59 PM
V0.5 of NR750 had the very best camera position and fov. v0.6 isn't as good. I haven't had a problem with any of the other bikes, so perhaps the 750's the only one.
These are Bullshits in the 0.5 was in wrong position.
Quote(this is trickier, as what you see is in fact the bike swinging below the camera). So after that it should just be a matter of positioning the camera correctly.
A head tracking camera position/rotation should be a trivial task for Piboso considering what he came up with so far. Also, what about including other views for the on-track session as well ? It could give more power into the hands of either modders and players; thus, a better overall experience. No ?
I'm surprised this doesn't seem to bother anyone else. Max is right, after tweaking the view settings for one bike, it's rather annoying to get an entirely different view on another. Especially obvious after going from WSBK 2015 to WSBK 2017 currently.
In my opinion, it's best to provide us with means of per bike adjustments. It will be tedious at first, but at least we won't have to adjust the view settings every time.
Hello,
That's a point we already have discussed (or at least, beggin to discuss) in the other thread about the new cemara mode. I'm glad to see that Max hasn't gave up on this subject.
Personnaly I think that the second solution is the best and may not be that hard to develop. Maybe, It would be possible to do it in the MaxHUD plugin. Save a configuration per bike ? Come on, there is already one setting per bike and the game saves a lot of things in the "documents" folder.
The best experience I had so far is (again) with Assetto Corsa. It's called the "Onboard Settings"
(http://www.racedepartment.com/attachments/ac-onboard-settings-jpg.131930/)
It saves your settings for each car, it is very easy to understand and to use.
To make it brief. IMO, Modders should implements the default view they want ! User should be able to override it...
Quote from: tchemi on April 05, 2017, 08:09:41 AM
Maybe, It would be possible to do it in the MaxHUD plugin.
Not doable (at least right now): a plugin cannot change GPB settings.
Looks like in the end we will have to resort to editing the camera files by ourselves as we see fit. Or maybe taking better camera settings and trying to adopt them to other bikes.
We can't edit the bikes files I think or it will be seen as a cheat online if the files don't match.
Quote from: tchemi on April 07, 2017, 09:47:09 AM
We can't edit the bikes files I think or it will be seen as a cheat online if the files don't match.
Then this problem is even more of an issue. I wasn't thinking about online, not being the onliner kind and all that, but yes, for online this wouldn't work.
Quote from: tchemi on April 07, 2017, 09:47:09 AM
We can't edit the bikes files I think or it will be seen as a cheat online if the files don't match.
Never tried personally, but it may or may not been the case (some files can be changed without getting a bike mismatch).
We should ask URBANCHAOS Ithink he tried it before
Quote from: tchemi on April 07, 2017, 08:13:53 PM
We should ask URBANCHAOS Ithink he tried it before
You can do it yourself: connect to a server with a bike, just to be sure you can connect.
The edit the cam position, check offline that you do see a difference on the cam position (just to be sure) and try to reconnect.
Quote from: HornetMaX on April 07, 2017, 08:15:28 PM
Quote from: tchemi on April 07, 2017, 08:13:53 PM
We should ask URBANCHAOS Ithink he tried it before
You can do it yourself: connect to a server with a bike, just to be sure you can connect.
The edit the cam position, check offline that you do see a difference on the cam position (just to be sure) and try to reconnect.
HéHé, I don"t know how to edit a camera :3
Quote from: tchemi on April 07, 2017, 10:52:53 PM
HéHé, I don"t know how to edit a camera :3
I suppose what you are looking for is hidden in the camera.cfg files :) Just don't forget to make a backup first.
mhm, Ok, Thank you, I'll give it a look.