PiBoSo Official Forum

World Racing Series => General Discussion => Topic started by: PiBoSo on July 29, 2018, 05:04:05 pm

Title: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on July 29, 2018, 05:04:05 pm

Work is in progress to rewrite the suspensions code and simulate the live axle torque reaction, the axle wrap, and so on.
No pictures or videos to show yet, sorry. There is still a lot to do.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on July 30, 2018, 02:16:42 am
Awesome news PiBoSo! This is exciting stuff!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on July 30, 2018, 02:18:32 am
Guess I better get to work....
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on July 30, 2018, 05:58:12 pm
FINALLY!!!!!!!

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on August 07, 2018, 09:51:38 pm
Bison160 dropped a personal message asking for news.
It's probably better to reply publicly in case anyone else is interested.

Work on the new suspensions code is progressing, but has been slowed down recently because some of time spent fixing and improving the netcode.

There still is a lot to do on the car physics. Unfortunately it's neither a quick nor an easy task.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on August 09, 2018, 04:26:14 am
Well, I'd say that is all good news. Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on August 16, 2018, 02:03:32 pm

Work is progressing.
The new suspensions simulation is almost done.
After that, all the cars will have to be updated and tuned to work with the new code.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on August 16, 2018, 04:24:52 pm
Awesome news! Hope its everything weve dreamed of and more. I'm sick of looking at this car in max. I wanna drive it!!!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on August 16, 2018, 10:14:38 pm

Also, fixed the bug when loading trainers.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on August 17, 2018, 06:11:52 am
Not sure I've noticed this "trainer" bug. Honestly though I haven't used the sim much lately.

I am a little curious as to what you are using to test/debug the new suspension code. Thanks for the updates. Looking forward to seeing it.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on August 22, 2018, 09:53:33 pm

Work on the suspensions simulation is still in progress.
The double wishbone and macpherson code is completed.
There still is work to do for the beam axle simulation.

In the meantime, in light of the recent netcode improvements, it has been decided to release a MX Bikes update.
This will pause WRS development for this week.

Apologies for the wait.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on August 23, 2018, 01:41:57 am
No problem on the wait. I scanned another track while we are "waiting" and still have a ton to do. The most important thing is that it is done right.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on August 31, 2018, 02:44:31 pm

Work on WRS resumed.

Added support for timer and standings displays on track.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on August 31, 2018, 06:32:59 pm
That's a must have! Thanks PiBoSo
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on September 05, 2018, 03:28:43 pm
Still working on physics and updating the cars' data.

Unfortunately the suspensions simulation also requires a rewrite of the differential and brakes code.

It will take a while. This is the biggest WRS physics update since Beta6, possibly the biggest ever  :-\

The plan is to release Beta14 around the end of this month.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on September 05, 2018, 05:09:20 pm
Sounds good PiBoSo, looking forward to it. I am making progress as well. Working with a chassis manufacturer to get their chassis info for phsyics and hopefully represent them graphically as well. 
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on September 17, 2018, 07:31:07 pm
Work on WRS resumed after a brief pause to release a KRP update.

Changed the format used to display data in physics debug mode, to be more user-friendly.
Also, work is in progress to update the differential simulation to work with the new suspensions code.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on October 01, 2018, 10:03:10 pm

Work is progressing, but unfortunately the new code ( especially the differentials ) and the data tuning is more challenging than expected  :-[

Also, the latest Kart Racing Pro update took more time than planned, and required a couple quick patches  :(

The plan is still to release a new build as soon as possible. Sorry for the wait.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on October 01, 2018, 11:45:34 pm
After waiting two years for these fixes I'm not too worried about a few extra weeks.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on October 02, 2018, 12:32:46 pm
Thanks for the update, but I'm with Pathry here. I would prefer this being done right and take a little more time than to rush it and have it not work as intended.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on October 12, 2018, 10:06:22 pm

The new simulation code has been completed a couple days ago.

Unfortunately however, the handling of the cars is not correct, and it cannot be fixed with simple physics data tuning.
There surely is a problem somewhere. New debug code has to be added to understand if the issue is due to the new suspensions or the new differentials code.

Again, apologies for the wait  :-[
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on October 13, 2018, 05:49:28 am
Why does a chicken coop have two doors?

Because if it had four it would be a chicken sedan.

Keep your chin up, there's at least 3 of us eagerly awaiting the update when you get it right. :)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on October 21, 2018, 10:55:56 pm
Once again, sorry for the lack of updates  :-[

The plan was to develop WRS and MX Bikes side by side ( for MXB the focus is on multiplayer, so useful for WRS, too ).

However, as you can maybe tell if you follow the development log, lately I am stuck on adding support for spectators.
Sadly it's taking way more time than planned.

Hopefully the task is finally in the last stint, and then work to fix the new suspensions simulation will resume.
Unfortunately the cars are still too "twitchy" with the new code, and the problem doesn't seem to be solvable tweaking the physics data or the car setup.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on October 22, 2018, 04:56:26 am
This is where I wish you would have taken a little more hands on with us approach. Just because a car you have in there is twitchy doesn't mean the code is wrong necessarily.  What if the suspension setup you have in there is just flawed and causing odd behavior. My other concern is you do all this work to implement it and it's not what we actually need?

This is just my concerns and I hope I'm completely wrong! Regardless, thanks for all the hard work. It will pay off!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on October 22, 2018, 10:07:07 pm
Quote from: bison160 on October 22, 2018, 04:56:26 am
This is where I wish you would have taken a little more hands on with us approach.


What do you mean with "hands on"?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Hawk on October 23, 2018, 07:40:17 am
Quote from: PiBoSo on October 22, 2018, 10:07:07 pm
Quote from: bison160 on October 22, 2018, 04:56:26 am
This is where I wish you would have taken a little more hands on with us approach.


What do you mean with "hands on"?


Probably means by letting us gain an insight into the problems and issues you are experiencing in sorting things out? To bounce ideas and thoughts off of us to help solve problems maybe? :)

The only problem of doing that of course would be that the majority of peoples possible solutions would be totally useless, but the idea of a sort of think-tank is to get possible solutions and ideas out there to solve problems with the hope that maybe just one of those sparky ideas will be a gem of a solution?  ;)

Anyway, it will be interesting to hear what Bison's thoughts are on this.  :)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on October 23, 2018, 01:19:13 pm
Hawk, you pretty much covered it. A little more discussion about how this is being implemented to ensure the time you are putting in is productive as possible in getting to a finished product. I understand that we will get a chance to try it out once the beta 14 is released, and we can give our feedback then, so if changes need to be made, they still can be. Correct me if I am wrong but your goal in adding these features is so myself and others can create mods that will in turn generate more WRS sales for you. That being said, if what we need isn't there or working correctly = no mods which = no more sales which = a big ole waste of your time.

Either way, I'm excited to see the progress.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on October 23, 2018, 09:39:46 pm
Simply put, the suspensions simulation has been changed from a purely geometrical ( inverse kinematic ) to a multibody one.
The first kind of simulation is very robust and works great with double wishbone and MacPherson.
However, it's not so good for the beam axle, because it makes very difficult to simulate effects like the axle wrap.
The multibody simulation is more realistic ( because each suspension part has its own mass and inertia ), but less robust because the various joints linking the bodies together are not infinitely stiff like in the geometric approach.
This, maybe, is the reason why the cars are now rather twitchy. Or it could be a bug somewhere... Still unknown  :(
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on October 24, 2018, 03:43:57 am
Thanks for the info. Definitely excited to tinker with it and get a true adjustable 4 link suspension working like it should.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 05, 2018, 11:42:23 pm

Quick update on development.
The code to debug the new suspensions simulation has been completed.
Several bugs in the simulation have been found and fixed.

However, the cars are still not stable enough when cornering on power.
Next step will be to temporarily revert to the old suspensions code to make sure that the problem is not somewhere else, for example the tyres.

Sorry for the wait.
Switching to the new suspensions is proving much more challenging than expected.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on November 06, 2018, 01:21:15 am
What car are you using for testing this stuff? What kind of suspension geometry?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 06, 2018, 11:08:18 pm

Unfortunately, it happens with all cars.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 07, 2018, 09:08:35 pm
Maybe a clue, at last.
There are subtle wobbles in the toe angles.

On the rear of the sprint cars, that is a solid axle of course, this issue seems to be due to missing linkages on the left and right. At the moment the only linkages are the differential and a panhard bar.
For all the other cars, the tie rods seem to be bugged, generating some bump steer.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on November 08, 2018, 12:03:18 am
Glad you've got hold of the end of a string!  Imagine trying to diagnose why your suspension isn't working right without being able to code custom debugging tools though like the genius who made you go down this miserable path. ;)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on November 08, 2018, 12:44:06 am
How on earth would the car work at all with only a pan hard bar and driveline? Lol it's missing at least 6 linkages. 2 tie rods on left/right and the shocks.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 08, 2018, 12:56:49 pm
Quote from: bison160 on November 08, 2018, 12:44:06 am
How on earth would the car work at all with only a pan hard bar and driveline? Lol it's missing at least 6 linkages. 2 tie rods on left/right and the shocks.


Of course there are the shocks, too.
It is "only" missing one linkage on the left and one on the right.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on November 08, 2018, 01:44:50 pm
Yeah, thats right, I forgot that the Sprint Cars used the torsion bar and a single tie rod in sort of a z-bar type suspension. The shocks are generally tied to the torsion bar. They do however use a jacobs ladder, not a true panhard bar. Is that coded in yet?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 08, 2018, 03:35:50 pm
Quote from: bison160 on November 08, 2018, 01:44:50 pm
Yeah, thats right, I forgot that the Sprint Cars used the torsion bar and a single tie rod in sort of a z-bar type suspension. The shocks are generally tied to the torsion bar. They do however use a jacobs ladder, not a true panhard bar. Is that coded in yet?


True, real sprint cars use a jacobs ladder. However, it is not simulated and has been approximated using a panhard bar  :-[
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 11, 2018, 01:02:33 pm

Sorry for abusing your patience.
Since the 8th WRS development is paused to focus on a new MXB release :-[
Hopefully it will not take more than a week.
Work on WRS will resume immediately after, with the goal to finally release a new build sometime around the 25th.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on November 24, 2018, 09:52:33 pm

Work has resumed on WRS.
Making quick and good progress.

Again, sorry for the wait.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on November 25, 2018, 05:34:09 am
Thanks for the update Piboso!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 08, 2018, 01:24:55 am
Though with the "misc tasks for release early this week we were close to release. I see the past few days we are back to "physics tuning" Wondering if a bug or something showed up in testing?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 08, 2018, 08:50:21 am
Quote from: bison160 on December 08, 2018, 01:24:55 am
Though with the "misc tasks for release early this week we were close to release. I see the past few days we are back to "physics tuning" Wondering if a bug or something showed up in testing?


Physics data tuning should be over now.

The new build should be ready for release. Final testing in progress.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on December 08, 2018, 04:52:04 pm
https://thumbs.gfycat.com/UnrealisticFilthyBullfrog-size_restricted.gif (https://thumbs.gfycat.com/UnrealisticFilthyBullfrog-size_restricted.gif)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 09, 2018, 05:43:19 pm

Does anyone know the approximate weight of the sprint cars tires and rims?
Even the weight of the full wheel would be helpful.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Napalm Nick on December 09, 2018, 06:08:50 pm
 found this under an eBay sprint car wheel search:

Keizer Polished Aluminum Direct Mount Beadlock Front Wheel with Mud Cover, 15 Bolt, 15" x 8"

11.4lbs

Rear

16.9lbs

Maybe useful
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 09, 2018, 06:19:18 pm

Thank you.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 09, 2018, 10:24:18 pm
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 08, 2018, 08:50:21 am
Quote from: bison160 on December 08, 2018, 01:24:55 am
Though with the "misc tasks for release early this week we were close to release. I see the past few days we are back to "physics tuning" Wondering if a bug or something showed up in testing?


Physics data tuning should be over now.

The new build should be ready for release. Final testing in progress.


Unfortunately during the testing a problem with the sprint cars wheels masses has been found.
A little more physics data tuning is needed, sorry  :-\
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 09, 2018, 10:35:52 pm
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 09, 2018, 05:43:19 pm

Does anyone know the approximate weight of the sprint cars tires and rims?
Even the weight of the full wheel would be helpful.


Anyone has info on the tires?
Hoosier has a lot of data, but NOT about the dirt oval tires  :(
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 09, 2018, 11:05:41 pm
PM me what you need. We had some Hoosiers calspan tested a few year back and got some good info. I'd have to dig through some old files and see what I can find though.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on December 10, 2018, 12:13:47 am
What kind of data are you needing, Piboso?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 10, 2018, 02:27:49 am
Oh, I see I missed a couple posts and just are looking for weight of a mounted tire and wheel. I'll see what I can figure out.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 10, 2018, 08:53:00 am
Quote from: bison160 on December 10, 2018, 02:27:49 am
Oh, I see I missed a couple posts and just are looking for weight of a mounted tire and wheel. I'll see what I can figure out.


Yes please.

Thank you.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on December 10, 2018, 11:46:27 pm
Fronts- 25 lbs
Left Rear- 45 lbs
Right Rear- 53 lbs

Taken from a sprint car team in Pennsylvania.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 11, 2018, 03:27:37 am
Looks very accurate there. BSauder. Piboso, I do have a question. Arent you using the weight to calculate the rotating mass of that tire? Which if so, you also need to calculate the hub and brake disc? Technically also the axle, but its inertia is very minimal.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 11, 2018, 08:35:32 am
Quote from: bsauder189 on December 10, 2018, 11:46:27 pm
Fronts- 25 lbs
Left Rear- 45 lbs
Right Rear- 53 lbs

Taken from a sprint car team in Pennsylvania.


Thank you very much!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 11, 2018, 08:37:24 am
Quote from: bison160 on December 11, 2018, 03:27:37 am
Looks very accurate there. BSauder. Piboso, I do have a question. Arent you using the weight to calculate the rotating mass of that tire? Which if so, you also need to calculate the hub and brake disc? Technically also the axle, but its inertia is very minimal.


Yes, now the axles and hubs have mass and inertia.
They are easier to estimate than the wheels, though.
The rear axle inertia is actually not minimal, because it includes the differential.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 11, 2018, 03:09:52 pm
True, I guess the ring gear would generate a decent amount of inertia. As much as a brake disc anyways.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on December 16, 2018, 07:38:44 am
Any updates?  I see you've been working on GP Bikes again, kind of disappointing to see.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 16, 2018, 10:37:33 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on December 16, 2018, 07:38:44 am
Any updates?  I see you've been working on GP Bikes again, kind of disappointing to see.


Work on GP Bikes resumed while the latest build of WRS is being tested internally.

Porting the latest changes to GPB is also useful to double check the upcoming MXB patch.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:21:35 pm

Work on Beta14 is technically completed.

Problem is, the cars still need tuning of the physics data to fit the new simulation code.

Do you think that it should be released anyway, while work to improve handling is in progress?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on December 18, 2018, 11:26:23 pm
Yes because I want to get my hands on it to see what it can do. Hopefully be able to finish what I started two years ago.

No because people won't understand why it changed, presumably for the worse, and will be up your butt about it.

Would you be comfortable with doing an unannounced release so modders could get to grips with it, maybe even pinpoint some bugs? Just something on the forum with a large disclaimer.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:43:47 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on December 18, 2018, 11:26:23 pm
No because people won't understand why it changed, presumably for the worse, and will be up your butt about it.


In theory you are correct. In practice, who would these "people" be? I'm afraid no one uses WRS anyway  :-\

Quote
Would you be comfortable with doing an unannounced release so modders could get to grips with it, maybe even pinpoint some bugs? Just something on the forum with a large disclaimer.


An unannounced release sounds like a oxymoron  :)
Maybe it would be better to have something like an internal testing team?

To be honest I'd prefer to wait and release Beta14 when it's ready.
However, it was promised months ago and I'm afraid the very few persons still interested in it might lose patience and faith  :-\
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on December 18, 2018, 11:56:39 pm
You build a foundation for the dirt oval sim community to race on, they will come. But first the brick and mortar has to be there first. Right now we have the mortar, just waiting for the bricks.

As far as an internal testing team, I sit here and twiddle my thumbs 95.9% of the time and play Battlefield for the rest of the time spent on the computer.
Phathry has a solid understanding of the modding side of things, I just run countless laps to see if it feels decent.

I'm looking forward to the update, one way or another. We need another dirt oval platform to build on, and this is it.

Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 19, 2018, 12:45:14 am
I'd gladly help test and tune. I still have work to do on my mod so it's not like you are holding me up exactly, but it would be nice to start getting some stuff in game and tuning on the physics side of things. Maybe you nailed it first try, but Id be willing to bet there will still be some bugs to sort out once us modders start running it through the paces.

As far as the question at hand...I'd say no to an official release if the official cars arent right for now, but the few of us that dont really care about what's in there now would surely benefit from the chance to get to work.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on December 19, 2018, 02:02:29 am
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:43:47 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on December 18, 2018, 11:26:23 pm
No because people won't understand why it changed, presumably for the worse, and will be up your butt about it.


In theory you are correct. In practice, who would these "people" be? I'm afraid no one uses WRS anyway  :-\


Very true, no better way to judge your active user base than to release a crappy update, surely they'll all come out of the woodwork to complain.  ;D

I did report the bug I am hoping is fixed with beta 14 over two years ago.  I think that alone justifies finding a way to get it into the hands of the few of us still holding out hope.  I just want to see my beam axle based suspension actually move kinematically correct. Besides, everyone loves a good oxymoron.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: DRkarter97 on December 19, 2018, 05:30:22 am
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:43:47 pm

Maybe it would be better to have something like an internal testing team?



Even just making mods for KRP, SKM has a couple of people we trust to try things before they go public. One of them doesn't even race karts he just gives us feedback. I don't have suggestions for who but I think any developer or someone who makes anything for video games should have people to test things before they go out to the general public.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Stout Johnson on December 19, 2018, 07:07:46 am
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:43:47 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on December 18, 2018, 11:26:23 pm
No because people won't understand why it changed, presumably for the worse, and will be up your butt about it.


In theory you are correct. In practice, who would these "people" be? I'm afraid no one uses WRS anyway  :-\

I might get hit on the head from bison and Phatry, but in my opinion you should always make sure the WRS release (or any of your sims for that matter) is 'complete' and having believable physics and handling. With many people you only have one chance to make a first impression. Amongst all the car sims out there on the market you have a hard start anyway. If there is someone willing to give a niche product a try, that person will most likely not come back after testing the demo version and then experiencing something that feels off. From then on this person will label WRS as 'arcade' or 'off' and be gone forever. So make sure to not lose those few that are willing to test your sim. Keeping those few can have a multiplying effect once your sim progresses.

I know you think, well there is nobody here anyways. Well that may be due to previous versions feeling 'off'. I myself almost gave up on WRS a couple of years ago, because pretty much all cars felt strange and the tire behaviour was unrealistic. It was only because of RX, which felt ok and gave me the feeling of the potential of WRS. But I know a lot of people that gave up on WRS because they felt it was feeling off. And most people don't give a second chance. A beta is always a beta, and nobody expects it to be 100%. But if the handling is pretty much off at the moment, then don't release it.

Quote from: PiBoSo on December 18, 2018, 11:43:47 pm
Maybe it would be better to have something like an internal testing team?

That's the way to go I think. Select a few. It will help you to get feedback from experienced people and will make your progress on your sim even better. It may also help you to find glitches and problems in the tire simulation, which has been a problem in the past imho. And those few testers can test and develop their mods along the line. It will make everybody involved happy and your development so much more efficient.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 19, 2018, 02:07:26 pm
No arguments there from me Stout! ;) I 100% agree with everything you said.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Stout Johnson on December 20, 2018, 06:42:45 am
Quote from: bison160 on December 19, 2018, 02:07:26 pm
No arguments there from me Stout! ;) I 100% agree with everything you said.

:)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 21, 2018, 10:22:24 pm

Thank you everyone for the support.

Kevin is currently working on tuning of the cars' physics data, while I am integrating a new bike for GP Bikes.
Hopefully the new build will be ready before the end of the year.

Also, a lot is going on around WRS behind the scenes. Hopefully it will soon be possible to announce big news.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 22, 2018, 08:16:18 am
Good to hear Piboso. Hopefully it's something that will be beneficial to my project,  but whatever it is, if it gets more people excited about WRS period that will be great. As they say, "What's good for the goose is good for the gander."
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 31, 2018, 09:59:38 pm

Apologies for not releasing Beta14 in 2018 and for just one update this year :-[

Heaven knows I tried  :(
I am still committed to release the best dirt simulator.
Also, during the past few days a partnership with a racing team started. The goal is to use WRS to help finding the car setup for each track.
2019 will be a great year for WRS.
Hopefully it will not be too late  :-\

Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 31, 2018, 10:21:43 pm
I like the sounds of that! Need a nearly perfect working vehicle dynamics to successfully simulate setup changes. Laser scanned tracks would be important as well. ;) let me know if I can help?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on December 31, 2018, 10:36:09 pm
Quote from: bison160 on December 31, 2018, 10:21:43 pm
I like the sounds of that! Need a nearly perfect working vehicle dynamics to successfully simulate setup changes. Laser scanned tracks would be important as well. ;) let me know if I can help?


As far as I know the team is already using laser scanned tracks on another software.
They will have to be converted.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on December 31, 2018, 11:20:44 pm
Quote from: PiBoSo on December 31, 2018, 10:36:09 pm
Quote from: bison160 on December 31, 2018, 10:21:43 pm
I like the sounds of that! Need a nearly perfect working vehicle dynamics to successfully simulate setup changes. Laser scanned tracks would be important as well. ;) let me know if I can help?


As far as I know the team is already using laser scanned tracks on another software.
They will have to be converted.


Unless they commissioned laser scanners and 3d artists, I assume they are using iracing. Whose tracks cannot be converted.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 01, 2019, 12:17:10 am

Please note that they are not racing on dirt ovals.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 02, 2019, 12:24:19 am

The collaboration with a vehicle dynamics engineer is already giving positive results!

Finally fixed the beam axle of the road car.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on January 11, 2019, 11:45:36 pm
A lot of work for other games but not really much on WRS? Such a buzz kill seeing we were all pumped for a release by the end of 2018.

Is it going to be mid-2019 before we see something?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 11, 2019, 11:46:33 pm
Sorry for the lack of updates.
Work progressed during the past days to tune the cars' physics data.

Unfortunately though, despite the efforts all the cars still go from neutral turning to snappy oversteer without warning.

We are trying to debug the physics but it's not easy.

As already suggested here, releasing a new public build with broken cars wouldn't be a good idea.
Another option could be to roll back to the old suspensions simulation. However, the new code is so much more realistic and has a lot more potential, especially for the beam axle, that it wouldn't make much sense.
Restoring the old suspensions code would have to be done anyway, though, to compare with the new one and help debugging.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 11, 2019, 11:51:02 pm
Quote from: bsauder189 on January 11, 2019, 11:45:36 pm
A lot of work for other games but not really much on WRS? Such a buzz kill seeing we were all pumped for a release by the end of 2018.

Is it going to be mid-2019 before we see something?


Apologies.
I'm the first to be frustrated by the lack of progress  :(

Doing the best I can.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on January 12, 2019, 02:09:24 pm
Wasn't trying to be rude, just was wanting to see where things were. As we progress in the sim racing world, I see a lot of people get burnt out.

If there's anything we can do as far as testing for bugs or debugging it with the cars we have, let us know!

Thanks again, and we look forward to it!
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 28, 2019, 11:53:13 pm

Sorry for the lack of news lately.

I'm focusing on GP Bikes development.
To be honest the difficulties fixing the physics issues and pressure from the other projects ( and external problems ) made me lose motivation...

I think I need help.
Is there anyone interested in helping WRS development?
I need someone able to tune the physics data and to test-drive the cars.
Maybe a modder developing a mod using real data? That would be optimal, I guess...

Don't know if there still is someone watching this space, though...  :-\
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on January 29, 2019, 03:33:13 am
Still Here. Still waiting. Still willing to help however I can.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on January 29, 2019, 05:30:16 am
Still here
Still knowledgeable
Still have access to real info, cars, drivers, and tire companies
Still willing to help
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Vladimir on January 31, 2019, 05:09:53 pm
STEAM version in aviable future?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 31, 2019, 10:07:03 pm
Quote from: bison160 on January 29, 2019, 03:33:13 am
Still Here. Still waiting. Still willing to help however I can.


Thank you.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 31, 2019, 10:14:29 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on January 29, 2019, 05:30:16 am
Still here
Still knowledgeable
Still have access to real info, cars, drivers, and tire companies
Still willing to help


Thank you.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on January 31, 2019, 10:35:37 pm
Quote from: Vladimir on January 31, 2019, 05:09:53 pm
STEAM version in aviable future?


Technically there already is a Steam version of WRS.

However, it cannot be released until the physics and features are improved.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on February 11, 2019, 11:40:54 pm

Work on WRS resumed.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on February 12, 2019, 04:56:02 pm
Cheers! ;D
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on February 18, 2019, 02:27:37 am
Quote from: PiBoSo

* WRS: fixed a physics bug


Just gunna tease us with this?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on February 27, 2019, 09:15:19 pm
Quote from: Phathry25 on February 18, 2019, 02:27:37 am
Quote from: PiBoSo

* WRS: fixed a physics bug


Just gunna tease us with this?


A bug in the new suspensions simulation code ( specifically for double wishbones ) was fixed.
Nothing major unfortunately.
Still stuck, trying to understand where the snappy oversteer comes from  :'(
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bison160 on March 01, 2019, 03:05:41 pm
What happened to getting the build out to a few mod devs to see if we could help uncover something.

Its not like we are going to bash you or WRS for being broken. I think the few that offered to help all understand it is not working correctly. We just want to get it dialed in and getting a few more hands on it can't hurt anything?
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: PiBoSo on March 01, 2019, 08:53:58 pm
Quote from: bison160 on March 01, 2019, 03:05:41 pm
What happened to getting the build out to a few mod devs to see if we could help uncover something.


Unfortunately GP Bikes development has been much slower than expected.
Also, a quick patch was needed after the release.
Then the modding tools had to be updated.
And now it's been so long since the latest Kart Racing Pro build, that I even received messages asking if development is over.
Problem is, I rely on KRP sales to survive, so I cannot afford to keep it stalling for too long.

Last but not least, there still are several issues with web hosting ( including this forum, sadly ) that have to be addressed.

Nonetheless, I want to try and work on WRS in parallel.

You have a new PM  ;)
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: Phathry25 on March 03, 2019, 04:24:55 am
Quote from: PiBoSo on March 01, 2019, 08:53:58 pm
You have a new PM  ;)


Something with the forum must be broken, I didn't receive a PM.
Title: Re: World Racing Series beta14 WIP
Post by: bsauder189 on March 16, 2019, 10:01:52 pm
Seems as if Phat's and I's inboxes both are down.

For that matter, the WRS side of advancement seems to be down as well. So much potential.. With the lack of modding in iRacing and the lack of content for the dirt oval racers, now is the time to shine.

Money to be made on this game, but stagnant progression won't ever let it succeed.