Messages

Thanks speedfr for the kind welcome.  We Canadians are certainly fond of our beaver so I hope to hear about "the French Canadian Beaver Licker team and the Beaver's Motorcycle Club" sometime.

As for the simulator... I don't have any unrealistic expectations.  Things like gravity, inertia, and gyroscopic effects are extremely difficult or impossible to duplicate (at least within our budgets).  Winters here are too long and the riding season too short so having a nice system that gives me a general realistic feel where I can practice things like hitting my reference markers as well as some fun racing will fulfill my needs quite nicely. 

With regard to that rcs feel... I was thinking about it a bit more.  There used to be fitness machines called Nautilus that had a gear system whereby at the start and end of the movement (where presumably the user was weakest) the resistance was the least.  And as they reached the center of the movement the load would become the greatest.  I'm wondering if something like that could be used in this application.  However we would want the greatest resistance at the start of the counter-steer.

My general feeling is that when counter-steering I want to feel that rcs the most when I'm pushing the hardest and as I decrease my input the rcs should diminish proportionately.  Almost like it's reflecting my input pressure back at me. (But a bit less so that the bars actually move. )

And as you mention, much of this seems like a Sisyphean task, but every once and a while we get a boulder to the top.   

Hi all,
  I've been lurking here for a couple of months and been impressed by the incredible talents on display here. I'm currently waiting on a rig from dd and am very excited to try it out. I decided to chime in here because I may have a perspective that is useful to the current discussion. I have had no experience whatsoever with racing games or simulators. I am a motorcycle racer and due to our long winters here in Canada I've been interested in putting together a motorcycle simulator that will provide me some practice and diversion during the non-racing seasons. I'm sure there are plenty of racers on the forum who have different takes on this than me. I'm just throwing in my 2 cents.

In response to speedfr's discussion relating to "try to go back to center and at the same time maintain the pressure on both sides give back this perfect feeling"

I'll use resistance to counter-steer (rcs) to describe that feeling that opposes counter-steer or the tendency for the bike to stay moving in the direction it is currently going. That feeling is strongest when you're initiating a change to the direction of the bike. The greater the change needed the more input force needs to be applied.  As you lean the bike over and reach the desired lean angle that push-back feel is greatly diminished. So much so that once the desired lean angle is reached the amount of rider input into the handlebars should be 0. The bike will now follow the new line that was set. The bike needs no additional input whatsoever to keep the lean and therefore the rcs feel should be 0. When riders describe the need to keep pressure on the handlebars when leaned over it's often the case that they are unintentionally loading the other side of the handlebar. Then when exiting the turn and standing the bike back up the rcs felt on the "outside" end of the handlebar is strong and then diminishes as the bike returns to an upright position.
rcs will be strongest when the desired lean angle (dla) is the greatest distance from the current lean angle (cla).  rcs = abs(cla-dla)  The rcs should be felt on the side of the handlebar that is initiating the counter-steer (i.e. the pushing hand)

To me this is VERY different than a steering wheel.  When initiating a turn with a steering wheel you generally feel the same pressure on the wheel and once you're in the turn you constantly feel the same pressure so when you release the wheel or ease up on your grip the wheel wants to return to the center position.

To simulate rcs you would need some kind of mechanical means to have the pressure be greatest at initiation and then diminish as the chosen lean angle is approached. I'm sure dd or speedfr could come up with something cool.

Ok... back to my lurker position.