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Hi Piboso.

We've just created a centreline(CL) for the full size IOM TT Track surface we've created which consists of 925 segments. I've double checked it to make sure we started with a straight and ended with a curve and that the end points have been closed and saved, also created the min/max lines and saved those to track folder too but we are getting a core.exe crash every time we try to load the track in GPB. I'm just wondering if there is still a max-limit on the number of segments allowed for use in TrackED?

Appreciate your advice on this matter. Thank you. 

Hawk.
PS: If you wish, I can give you a link to the track. 

The limit is 585 segments.

There doesn't appear to be any servers up.

Is there a problem?

Everything should be back to normal now.

day off


http://www.youtube.com/v/j6TmogXhOZ8

* KRP: work on the Mychron5

* KRP: work on the user interface

* KRP: work on the Steam page


https://www.youtube.com/v/PstrAfoMKlc

* KRP: work on the dash and the new Mychron5


http://www.youtube.com/v/D8xi0OvhXwo

Dear Storris,

we had a lengthy internal discussion, and also asked for advice to a friend with experience with laser scanning, licensing and much more.
All things considered, we decided we are not interested in your project, and will go our own way. It may sound harsh to post this message in public, but I think it's important to make clear to everyone that we are NOT involved in your campaign.

Now for some clarifications:
1) Working with the point cloud of a 60km circuit would be impossible without dedicated hardware and software. Even the mesh will be complex enough that it will probably have to be split into sections.
2) It's probably better to have the government help for the scan, for licensing reasons and because they are able to close the roads. You can remove traffic with two passes, but you cannot remove parked cars, for example.
3) We are not interested in a collaboration with another 4-wheel developer. You should probably do some research before messaging a developer, because it sounded a little bit offensive, as we have some experience with simulated cars, too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR9EgFz4HK0
4) To be honest, it doesn't seem like you are very interested in motorcycles or sidecars... The feeling is that you want the Mountain Course in a car simulator, maybe even a specific one... If this is correct, could you please tell us which one? 

Hope to see you on TTB 

KRP: some general code cleanup


http://www.youtube.com/v/65XSHM3jlAY

The idea is great on the paper and donate for this project will be a pleasure. But some points need to be clarified :

- Do you have any guarantee that the IOM government will allow laser scanning?
- How can we be sure that the track will not get in a big investor hands without any ability for bakers to get a hand on the laserscan?
- How do you plan to manage the track licensing between modders providing IOM for free and some developers selling it?

If all of that is clear for everyone, my Paypal account is ready 

EDIT : Polyphony Digital was at IOM nearly 2 years ago to laserscan the track. We don't have any more informations yet but maybe something is not that far from release from them. Of course it won't be open source.

Very good points.

* GPB / WRS / KRP / MXB: completed support for spectating / replay cameras control from plugins


http://www.youtube.com/v/xJh47LybCkU

I don't plan on having rewards for backers other than the knowledge that they have brought themselves one step closer to racing on the TT course.   However, if we succeed with minimum funding we will look to the stretch goals of hiring developers to build tracks.  I haven't got details of this finalised yet, so there is no concrete information to give.

I know for a fact that I am willing to donate simply to make the data available, and I am receiving plenty of support so far, but whether enough people feel as I do will only be answered by doing the project.  We will see in ~60 days how successful it is.

The scanning company undoubtedly has what is needed to create the mesh, but they will also have to clean the point cloud first.  This will undoubtedly add costs, but it could be added as a stretch goal.  I'll have to wait until office hours for information from the scanners before trying to make this decision.

If PiBoSo were willing to support this project as the 'official' 2-wheel track builder, then I think it would be a great incentive for 2-wheel sim racers to add their own support to it.

There already is a person working on the TT ( trackside objects, textures, shaders, ... ), so no additional developers are needed on this side
Kickstarter suggests a 30 days campaign... 60 are maybe too much.

Official support may be tough call. If we are to be actively involved in the campaign and announce our project, then we could as well do our own campaign...
Exactly what kind of "support" would you expect?

P.S. Please note that we already planned to add at least one car for those that are not into motorcycles, so our simulator will not be two and three-wheels only 
P.P.S. If you are serious about the project, feel free to contact via PM or email, in case you feel a public forum is not the best place for further discussion

Having the data & funding crowd sourced, will simply save you the costs of developing for other titles, so I hope you can sort of see how this project will be to your benefit.  If you believe it is, then I'd really appreciate the input from actual developers such as yourself.

If you are serious and can successfully find the funding, this would for sure beneficial to the TT simulator, because it would spare us a tedious Kickstarter campaign and the pressure deriving from being under the public eye so early in development ( not to talk about the almost sure backlash from announcing a new project while 4 mores are already in development ).

Hi PiBiSo,

I didn't know you were working on a TT sim.

This project is simply as I've said.  Lots of people across many sim/racing platforms want to race on the Isle of Man, but we've all been sat around for a decade waiting for a guy who has made it clear that completing his project is not a priority, though I was pleasantly surprised to find that there seems to be some motivation amongst this community to get something working for themselves.

APR suggested I get in contact with another company as they weren't able to complete the mobile scanning that would be needed around sections of the Mountain Course.  I too thought that the figure given was extremely competitive, so I didn't hesitate in asking them for an official quotation, which is in the works as we speak.

I appreciate that this is might look as though it will step on the toes of projects such as yours, but unless you plan on using obscure or proprietary tools, your track will almost certainly be ported to other titles within a month of its release.  Having the data & funding crowd sourced, will simply save you the costs of developing for other titles, so I hope you can sort of see how this project will be to your benefit.  If you believe it is, then I'd really appreciate the input from actual developers such as yourself.

You're unlikely to lose custom if you're providing a full TT experience - http://www.racedepartment.com/threads/would-you-be-interested-in-a-laser-scanned-isle-of-man-tt.120475/ - Open source & modding is not to everyone's taste, there are plenty of people who want a fully-baked, plug & play solution.  PlayStation & XBox sales should be proof enough of that.

As to whether or not the company can supply a mesh, this is something I'll have to ask them during office hours, but from what I've been reading it should be fairly trivial for any potential track builders to create their own mesh in their preferred format, with their preferred tools.  Supplying a cloud rather than a mesh should will also allow builders to remove anomalies from the scan, such as the inevitable traffic, withou having to pay for the scanning company to do it before building a mesh.

Hope this clears up what you needed,

Best
SM

Could you please write what do you plan to give as reward to the Kickstarter campaign backers?
What makes you think that someone would donate to laser scan the Mountain Course without the direct support of a developer / modder with the time and skills to actually model and texture the whole circuit? Also, please note that not all simulators / games may be capable of loading a 60km track.

It is not trivial at all to convert several gigabytes of point cloud to a usable mesh. It may be doable for the track maker, but for sure the laser scanning companies have the software, hardware and experience to do a much better and faster job.

While the forum is busy, I've spoken to a couple of the companies involved in laser scanning Rockingham Raceway for Live for Speed.  They've given an approximate cost of £10,000 to scan the full course.  They'll be providing me with an official quote later this week, and all things going well, I'll have the KickStarter up & running by this time next week.

I'd appreciate any info you can give on what data track builders need, can they work from 'coloured point cloud information', or would it need to be processed further?

The idea behind the KickStarter is to open source the data for all sims/race games. COuld I count on the support of this forum to make that happen?

Oh yes, and thank you for the welcome

Hello.
As most of the users here already know, this is a very sensitive topic.
You are new here, so are probably not aware that work has been in progress for several months now to create a full TT simulator ( including sidecars and pitstops ).
The plan is to start a KS campaign soon for the same reason you have: to laser scan the whole Mountain Course.
Could you please give more info about your project?
I didn't know of the Rockingham laser scanning. Why did they need two companies? A quick search points to APR Services: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nxvf_52KNM
What's the other company?
The quote you got is extremely competitive. Does it include the generation of the 3D mesh of the road and walls? The raw points cloud is not useful for track making.

It wouldn't be very good for our project if the laser scanning data was freely available to any simulator, but at least TTB would be the only one with motorcycles and sidecars.

* KRP: started work to support replay / spectating camera controls from plugins


http://www.youtube.com/v/TFrMDGfW_Sg

It is complicated, but needed because it was decided to add shared tyres to MX Bikes.