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Messages - Furious

61
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 20, 2014, 12:39:18 PM
As I said. I messed up pitch and roll words at some point.

We are going to pitch the bike forward while breaking and pitch it backawrd while accelerating.

We do roll the bike in the opposite direction of the turn if the biker moves to the center of corner.

And as i sad. We can simulate ACCELERATING. When we pitch the bike 60 degrees backwards one vector is 0.85 G and the one to simulate gravity is 0.5 G

I'm sure you are wrong with your directions and I'll show that on the picture.

There is gonna be more space for biker to move around.
62
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 20, 2014, 12:52:38 AM
QuoteVery unclear: you mean  that if the bike in GPB stays horizontal and accelerates, your rig will wheelie ?
yes. Why? Cause i simulate forces. Keep the force vector on the same direction. Imagine : gravity acceleration vertical and bike acceleration horizontal vector. Sum them up and you have the angle . We Pitch the bike to make that new vector parallel to gravity vector.

Sorry. I missmatched the words. I meant pitch when writing roll and the opposite.

And the most important thing. We are using oculus rift. So we can "cheat" with forces even more. We tested it and it really works. Just hope Piboso will provide oculus support for our tests.
63
General Discussion / Re: Physics concerns
November 20, 2014, 12:25:53 AM
My other problem is related to this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ymd4Y83W8tw&feature=youtu.be

I have already seen that you claim that that's ok, but I'm not that sure about that.
What itches me the most is the moment when the bike is finishing the trick. When the bike spins on yaw axis, when the front wheel touches the ground and magically it stops. When the bike spins with the speed like on the video and the force comes from the contact of the tire/track where is the spinning kinetic energy of the bike? When the force is not in line with (basicly speaking) center of gravity, there is no way to act like this. I feel like the spin inetria (kg*m^2) parameter is wrong in some way. Or the positioning of the forces.

The other thing. At some point in the video bike is going backwards on the rear wheel. How is that possible? I asume that no one have used a clutch at that moment so it was tottaly wrong.

Wheel should either slip on the tarmac as the direction changed dramaticly as so the friction forces or it somehow menaged to get a grip it should make a tottal mess with the engine. What was it doing? Engine spining in other direction? I would love to se replay file and analyze it.

Ps. Simulated physics is never perfect. It can't be. But you can be close Piboso ;)
64
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 20, 2014, 12:17:40 AM
Pitch axis and roll axis are dictated by GP Bikes however not the actual orientation of the bike in space but two parameters combined. Main part of the motion is to use part of the gravity to imitate accelerating. when we use up to 60 degrees in roll, you can easily calculate how much G you get from it. But we also use the roll orientation to provide feedback about bike state. For example, take a look on 2 situations:
-Bike is accelerating but keeps horizontal
-Bike is not accelerating but you are doing wheelie

the senses feel almost the same thing, so we combine both informations with proper scaling to provide feedback

input for the GP bikes are all the standard controls of the bike. Everything that has part in real riding. Your position ( hard to track the bikers center of the gravity so we use head tracking) handlebars force ( or axis depends what will be working with GP Bikes direct steering) and some obvious like throtle, brake etc.

on pitch axis we want to move the bike according to the force vector.
If you are turning and keep straight on the bike the force vector is parallel to your lean angle. So to simulate it we don't have to roll to the sides at all.
But if you move your body of the bike to the center of corner you move your center of gravity so the force vector wont be paraller any more ( as it still goes trough the center of gravity of the whole setup).
So as follow, we won't change the value of the force, but, at least keep the right direction of it. That's why we will pitch the bike in opposite direction of turning if the biker moves.
65
General Discussion / Re: Physics concerns
November 19, 2014, 11:58:50 PM
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 19, 2014, 11:20:42 PM
Quote from: Furious on November 18, 2014, 04:03:39 PM
The bike engine with it's spinning mass energy on the passive revs (the minimum revs of the engine to keep going. Ones that throttle closed) with torque it generates should be able to get bike going even with really low acceleration ( keeping in mind that bike ecu keeps the fuel level high enough to not let engine stop.)
I think that's wrong, you can try on any real bike: if you don't give it a bit of gas when you release the clutch from stand, the engine will bog down and die, no matter how carefully you release the throttle.
I have managed to do so, so it is possible.
Quote
Also, I don't think the ECU does what you say: it only controls the idle when the throttle is shut and the clutch fully disengaged. You can check this too on a real bike: get in 6th gear and slow down to 10Kmh ... it will shut off. Idle control does not kick in.
Maybe I'm wrong about the bikes. But its there for sure in cars. When you are slowing down on a gear, the fuel consumption is 0 untill revs are lower than planed. ECU gives fuel then. You can observe it on the car with real time fuel consumption dial.
Quote
Quote from: Furious on November 18, 2014, 04:03:39 PM
However in GP Bikes even with the revs on about 7000 its not possible to not shut the engine down, no matter how gentle you are with clutch. If you won't add throtle the engine will stop.
Not for me: if I hold the throttle still (so that the revs in neutral are at let's say 7000), when I gently release the throttle without changing the throttle the bike moves off.
But you have to be very gentle indeed. I can start with the revs never exceeding 5000.

At least on the 990.

MaX.
But still, revs should go down AND STOP at certain level. Now its going all the way to 0 if you are not giving it more throttle all the time while accelerating. How much throttle you use to start rolling with a bike? just a little in real life. in GP Bikes you have to use about 80% of it just to not shut your engine down. Maybe I'm wrong, but can someone tell me something like "racing bikes have it like that because..." or something. I just see some problem.
66
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 19, 2014, 11:18:19 PM



thats what me and my friends are coming up with.
Oculus rift.
Biker possition tracking.
Acceleration simulation ( upt to 80 % of the real bike acceleration)
corner simulation ( leaning in different direction than turn)
handlebars feedback
all inputs
etc.

also the part with servos drivers and plugin for GP Bikes already done.
67
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 19, 2014, 08:42:41 PM
Really guys? Can't you see that all of those "simulators" are useless? What are they simulating? With all that wobling left/right front/back ? Where is the usage of gravity to simulate acceleration? there is force feedback on the handlebars? Where is information about  position on the bike even gathered?  Every single one you have shown are shity work.
68
Custom hardware / Re: Full motion simulator
November 19, 2014, 05:39:00 PM
Isn't that an email from me? I have send you one couple of months ago but with no replay. I'm building a full motion bike simulator.

Or am I not understanding you correctly. You were requested to sell someone a full motion bike simulator based on GP Bikes?
69
General Discussion / Physics concerns
November 18, 2014, 04:03:39 PM
Hi there. I have some concerns that came to my mind lately. It's not like "I don't like it so it must be wrong" but some general law of physics that doesn't seem to work now. Hope to discuss it with users with engineering experience.

First of I doubt that clutch simulation works in proper way. By my knowledge from university of technology where I study torque carried by friction clutch ( used in most petrol engine vehicles) is based on the friction parameter, size of the clutch and the normal force working on the clutch. So with the clutch lever I directly decide how much torque I put on the rear wheel and all corresponding elements (gearbox, chain and everything that has mass). The bike engine with it's spinning mass energy on the passive revs (the minimum revs of the engine to keep going. Ones that throttle closed) with torque it generates should be able to get bike going even with really low acceleration ( keeping in mind that bike ecu keeps the fuel level high enough to not let engine stop.) However in GP Bikes even with the revs on about 7000 its not possible to not shut the engine down, no matter how gentle you are with clutch. If you won't add throtle the engine will stop. If you look at this picture for example http://pirateslair.net/RemusS1000RRFullSysDyno1.JPG you will see that on 7000 RPM bike generates about 90 Nm. So If I will use 40 of it by using my clutch the revs should go down to the level when the forces are equal and the bike should keep accelerating with the torque of more or less 40 Nm. But in GP Bikes revs goes down all the time causing engine to stop.

I have no more time now so I'll finish latter with my other concerns.

cheers.
70
As a part of constructive feedback I want to ask something. Is the moment of inertia calculated based on the weight of individual parts? Cause I couldn't see any corresponding parameter in bike tools.
Is the moment of inertia constant for the bike with specific values set or is it done other way?
71
Quote from: HornetMaX on November 06, 2014, 11:15:25 PM
Quote from: girlracerTracey on November 06, 2014, 02:40:34 AM
The thought that keeps occurring to me if I am honest is this: How can anyone devise a motorcycle racing simulation in the absence of full & proper input, testing and ongoing consultation with individuals who race in real life or have done so in the past ?
Engineers do this all the time. Because physical models are physical models.
I've been working for years on satellite and spacecraft simulators and guess what, we had no feedback from satellite or spacecraft drivers :)

Also, on this whole forum, I've met no more than 2-3 people with riding experience that could provide useful feedback (beyond basic stuff I mean).
Most of the other riders (whichever riding skill they may have) have such a little understanding of physics that they are totally unable to translate what they feel into useful info.

Quote from: PiBoSo on November 06, 2014, 03:58:54 PM
To enable debug mode, edit the file profile.ini ( located in the profile directory under "profiles" in "My Documents"\PiBoSo\GP Bikes\ ) and add:

[debug]
physics = 1

w00t ! Thanks ! I was about to ask for this two days ago (mainly for a tire overheating problem with the wss 600, but who knows).

MaX.

Just waited for someone to point that out, so I didn't have to. THX Max :)
72
Support / Re: OCULUS DKII..HOW?
October 31, 2014, 09:40:11 AM
Quote from: PiBoSo on October 30, 2014, 07:47:44 PM
Quote from: vash on October 30, 2014, 04:49:00 PM
Hi,everybody ,I can't start GPBIKES beta6B with my oculusdk2. It's me or the beta don't support the rift!?

GP Bikes Beta6 does somehow support the Oculus Rift DK2, but it's not a pleasant experience.

I would love to try it anyway, please. Is it possible to "turn it on"?
73
Quote from: Hawk_UK on October 21, 2014, 11:16:04 AM
Quote from: ALEale on October 21, 2014, 11:05:01 AM
Quote from: Hawk_UK on October 21, 2014, 10:45:17 AM
Is this event going to be streamed live? I hope it is because the last live stream event you held was BRILLIANT!!  ;D 8) 8) 8)

If it is live streamed, then I for one will certainly be watching you guys.  ;D

Hawk.

Furious is the STREAMING GUY :D i think you have to ask to him ;)  last race was a great livestream :)

Thanks ALE. I'll give him a PM later if he doesn't see this post first.  ;)

Thanks mate!  8)

Hawk.

Ohhh man !!!! Why haven't you PMed me about that?
I would love to stream the event again, but had no idea it's today :(
74
General Discussion / Steam group once again!
October 11, 2014, 09:18:16 PM
Hi everyone.
I'll try to reincarnate the steam group. I Just think that's really good way to communicate with players and finding others to ride with.
so... follow the link http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198065891201/groups/. Follow the instructions and PLAY!
Will try to make it nice and interesting over time.

It's just a lot nicer to see "someone111 is playing GP Bikes", then you instantly run it too :)
75
Racing / Re: [Special Event] WSS600 @ Monza
September 25, 2014, 10:03:27 PM
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=318552557
This is just beautifull :) The look of the full grid fullfiled with amazing bikes were just astonishing :) Loved that and w8ing for more :)

PS. Add your GP Bikes to your steam accounts, so wi will be easier to get someone to play with :)