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March 28, 2024, 09:49:04 AM

Extreme rumble fun

Started by h106frp, September 07, 2015, 08:30:34 PM

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h106frp

Though i would give it a go.... Rumble chair mk1  ;D

The signals from the telemetry and the sub woofer audio channel on the sound card are passed to a low pass filter and amplifier board and then out to a 2*120 watt ARCAM Delta power amplifier. The amplifier was a freebie as it needed a few repairs to get it working - it had been badly abused at some time and quite a few burned and failed components needed replacing. Brilliant amp now though, it will do nearly 300 watts in bridged mode (real watts not p.m.p.o.  ;) )

The software host for the telemtry to USB microcontroller running alongside the sim. This integrates into the same micro i use for my other controller rig  8)


DACs, low pass filters, amplifiers and mixer circuit board, PIC micro with USB in the foreground



The power amplifier drives a total of 4 cheap 100 watt tactile transducers. Each channel has 2 transducers, currently bike transverse accelerations on 1 channel and bike vertical accelerations mixed with the sub woofer audio on the other channel. I decided i needed the sub audio mainly to improve the effect over rumble strips and too make the system flexible for use with other games. I will probably add more channel mixing options as i tweak the design a bit.

The transducers are fixed to the bottom of my PC office chair as X-Y pairs ;D




Once attached to the chair it shakes and rattles really well, enough to be looking at isolating the chair from the floor before i disturb everyone else too much  ::)  8)

You really do not get the full effect of the transducers until you attach them to a structure, it really amplifies the effect.

Love the effect, quite amazing seeing the bike take a bump on the screen and feeling it in the real world at the same time. Still some tweaking and experimenting to do and i might revise the mounting and move 2 of the drivers to the front of the chair to broaden the area that really feels the shaking effect.

Having a lot of fun with this silly little project  :)

davidboda46

I love it man! Great work!

Cheers,

/David "Gonzo" Boda #46
"THE EDGE... THERE IS NO HONEST WAY TO EXPLAIN IT BECAUSE THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO REALLY KNOW WHERE IT IS ARE THE ONES WHO HAVE GONE OVER"

BOBR6 84

You should work for Carlsberg  ;D 8)

Hawk

Love all this tinkering about and testing stuff like you do! I can only imagine what this would be like.... Feels great I bet!!  ;D 8) 8)

Nice one mate!  ;D 8)

Hawk.

h106frp

Need to find some good isolators for the chair feet - household management (the missus) have informed me that it works a bit too well and is shaking the whole living room ceiling as well as my chair (PC is in the upstairs spare room)  ;D 8)

The one conclusion that i have draw so far is that the telemetry acceleration signals supply the most convincing and detailed data to drive the shakers as far as the bumps and ripples in the track being transmitted - its very convincing!

The sub bass signal is reliant on the games audio which is not so detailed, you get a nice low level 'background' effect when moving, track rumble strips are very good and the bit of engine low rpm rumble is nice but i do think you would not get the best from a commercial 'buttkicker' using just the audio channel. The game audio would really need to be adjusted to generate suitable sub woofer outputs for suspension and tyre impacts - probably quite easy to do and i guess its how the bigger car and flight sims work.

For the rumble curious.......     8)

If you have a newer sound card with a dedicated sub woofer output (mine is Realtek HD audio) you can enable this extra output in the control panel even if you are only using stereo speakers for audio and experiment with some rumble fun this way - at least for the rumble strips and engine. Just need an old hi-fi amp and a driver.

I picked up my heavy duty drivers from the web for a little under £16 each, for the more adventurous the web has many examples of modifying old hi-fi speaker drivers into simple tactile transducers/body shakers.

HornetMaX

To get a feeling of the engine, in stead of using the game's audio, I'd probably try to use the RPM signal and add some "fake" vibrations depending on it.
I doubt anybody would ever design a game's audio with your usage of it in mind :)

MaX.

h106frp

It would really need to be a different transducer for full engine rpm, the axial drive tactile units are really only intended for low frequency up to about 100Hz, after this you do not get much useful mass displacement. It does give a nice effect when you roll off the throttle on the 990 bike though :)

I did start a scheme for a super rumble motor (variable speed rotating mass) that will drive directly from the rpm telemetry signal - must try and finish it  ;D

You are right about the game audio although i think the flight sim community put more though into this with runway vibration, landing impacts and airframe vibration all being modeled through the audio channels - i think this is where the seat shaker idea started.

Much simpler to have the option to push the telemetry acceleration signals out through the sub woofer audio channel  8)

HornetMaX

Quote from: h106frp on September 08, 2015, 07:58:10 AM
You are right about the game audio although i think the flight sim community put more though into this with runway vibration, landing impacts and airframe vibration all being modeled through the audio channels - i think this is where the seat shaker idea started.
To be honest I think the whole idea of using sound to drive rumble is just a cheapo move from the builders of buttkickers: no need to write game-specific code, just take the audio out (or sub out) and turn some knobs, done. Works well (kind of) for movies (even if I never understood why one would like to have his ass rumble while watching a movie), but for games is ... well, cheapo :)

MaX.


h106frp

Totally agree, yet the seat rumbler is very popular amongst the sim-pit crowd (car and plane). From my small experiment i would have to say they are really missing something with not having 'true' vibration signals applied to the transducers. It is nice to mix in a bit of the filtered audio but the real 'feel' is in the telemetry data that is output through my microcontroller and DAC's.

This failing has been recognised though and a company called SimXperience has attempted to capitalise on the concept with a product called SimVibe - i believe their add-ons are quite expensive though but the hardcore simpit builders seem to have very deep pockets  :)

HornetMaX

Quote from: h106frp on September 08, 2015, 08:33:01 AM
This failing has been recognised though and a company called SimXperience has attempted to capitalise on the concept with a product called SimVibe - i believe their add-ons are quite expensive though but the hardcore simpit builders seem to have very deep pockets  :)
Yeah, somebody working on a kart "simulator" (KRP + kart chassis as input device + SimVibe) contacted me to use my telemetry tool but he was stuck on an old version of KRP because of SimVibe: they didn't follow closely the releases of KRP so their plugin was not kept up to date.

BTW after the initial contact and after I have made my telemetry tool work with an older version of KRP (and provided it to them), I haven't heard back from them. Dunno, maybe their project just died.

MaX.

Napalm Nick

A W E S O M E           H!              Hehe!  ;D 8) 
"The post you are writing has been written at least ten times already in the last 15ish years. Its already been reported, suggested, discussed, ignored or archived (but mostly ignored). Why are you doing it again?"

CapeDoctor

it looks like a super setup - the sort of thing that pushes the immersion factor up several notches.
i'm one of the ButtKicker users, and i love it - from flying my Wellington through intense flak to the great rumble feel in many race sims, and great for movies, lol  8)
slight tweaks to the settings can make huge improvements, no doubt with your system, as well  ;D

h106frp

Thanks, it is a lot of fun and very immersive, but i do need to solve the issue of isolating the chair from the floorboards  ;)

It does seem possible to create an audio stream with the acceleration data using directX and mix it onto the audio output, i wonder if enough ButtKicker users exist to make it worthwhile?

HornetMaX

Quote from: h106frp on September 08, 2015, 05:32:54 PM
Thanks, it is a lot of fun and very immersive, but i do need to solve the issue of isolating the chair from the floorboards  ;)
I'd try with a fitness mat. They have some under Powerplate machines.

Quote from: h106frp on September 08, 2015, 05:32:54 PM
It does seem possible to create an audio stream with the acceleration data using directX and mix it onto the audio output, i wonder if enough ButtKicker users exist to make it worthwhile?
Why don't you just drive the buttkicker from your electronics ?
I mean, instead of software mixing it to an audio output, just "stream" your audio signal to the buttkicker, no ?

MaX.

h106frp

Good idea on the exercise mat, i will look for one at the weekend.


I already have all my bike acceleration drive signals from my electronics and just thinking out loud for options for people with commercial buttkickers or home made items (recycle those old PC sound systems  ;) ). It might be a cheap and easy way to supply a better quality signal than just relying on game audio.