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More ingame adjustments

Started by C21, February 09, 2014, 08:56:13 AM

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C21

TCS and Map switch wile riding.
on race bikes maybe AW and EB also.
# Member of the CAWS Racing Team #


Stout Johnson

Quote from: C21 on February 09, 2014, 07:24:01 PM
TCS and Map switch wile riding.
on race bikes maybe AW and EB also.

as switching the mapping often requires change of engine brake settings I am pretty sure you can do it while riding on modern race bikes... otherwise it wouldn't really make sense.
    -----------   WarStout Kawasaki Team   -----------

HornetMaX

Quote from: Stout Johnson on February 09, 2014, 07:29:00 PM
Quote from: C21 on February 09, 2014, 07:24:01 PM
TCS and Map switch wile riding.
on race bikes maybe AW and EB also.

as switching the mapping often requires change of engine brake settings I am pretty sure you can do it while riding on modern race bikes... otherwise it wouldn't really make sense.
Hmm not sure, maybe the engine brake setting is tied to the map, so it changes automatically.

I'm tempted to say TCS is the only one we have absolutely no doubt at all.

Maybe Piboso knows more, I'll let it to him.

MaX.

PiBoSo

Quote from: C21 on February 09, 2014, 07:24:01 PM
TCS and Map switch wile riding.
on race bikes maybe AW and EB also.

TCS, engine, AW and EB settings are most likely "packed" in a single, pre-programmed, mapping switch, though.
"La perfezione non è il nostro obiettivo, è la nostra tendenza".

Stout Johnson

Quote from: PiBoSo on February 09, 2014, 08:30:03 PM
Quote from: C21 on February 09, 2014, 07:24:01 PM
TCS and Map switch wile riding.
on race bikes maybe AW and EB also.

TCS, engine, AW and EB settings are most likely "packed" in a single, pre-programmed, mapping switch, though.

Well that could be true. Maybe anyone knows someone who can confirm this?

Piboso, it should be possible to arrange pre-defined electronics packages in garage right? So in free-practice every rider could test different settings, allot them to ca. 3-5 pre-defined spots (mapping/TCS/EB/AW) and switch thru them sequentially while riding - pretty much like we can atm with engine mappings, right? This info could be saved in the set-up.... or as a seperate file? or for each bike? dunno, which makes most sense...
    -----------   WarStout Kawasaki Team   -----------

C21

February 10, 2014, 10:05:40 AM #20 Last Edit: February 10, 2014, 10:45:59 AM by C21
QuoteTCS, engine, AW and EB settings are most likely "packed" in a single, pre-programmed, mapping switch, though.
Sorry to disagree.
On modern Street Sportbikes (like Yamaha R1 since 2012) you have: TCS (6 steps) and Map switch (3 steps) which are acting indipendently. No "prepack".
So it is on modern Racebike.

QuoteOn the switchblock of the left side handlebar there is now a large TCS (Traction Control System) rocker switch that lets you select one of six levels of electronic intervention for when the rear tyre breaks loose. On the other handlebar, a mode button allows you to choose one of three throttle maps: a quickfire setting for track-day heroics, a standard mode similar to the response of previous R1s, and a slow-mo setting that could be useful when riding on slippery road surfaces. Both the TCS and the throttle settings can be adjusted on the move and, unlike the Euro sportsbikes that first introduced such race-bred electronic riding aids to road- going motorcycles, the access to the adjustments is quick, simple and intuitive.
Source: http://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/bikes/6958286/New-R1-a-better-bike-for-the-buck

Edit:
Interesting view on the insight of a MotoGP rider on a RCV213: EB is adjustable!
Quote"During the race I exhausted all the options on my bike with electronics," Rea said speaking on Sunday night. "I was playing a lot with traction control settings, also mapping changes and engine brake changes. To be honest, it got to the point where I was just confused and I had to just open the throttle and do my best, pick the line. It was just one of those things that a race can teach you, when the tire drops down, when the fuel load drops down, how you need to work with the bike. With more time I can understand but for a huge part of that race I was a little bit confused whether I was doing the right thing with the buttons or the wrong thing."

Rea was asked exactly what he was looking for, more traction control or less, to help him get to the end of the race. He answered that the confusion was caused by the differences between the bikes and the tires in the World Superbike and MotoGP series. "The [traction control] strategies work completely differently," Rea explained. "In World Superbike during the race, normally I would flip the traction control to let the electronics have more control. In effect, basically you're trying to save the tire at the end of the race. Here it works the opposite way, where you have to reduce the traction control and let the bike spin more, because the engine is slowing the bike down too much," Rea said.

The problem arose about halfway through the race, Rea explained. "Around half race distance, I took a lot of traction control off the bike, but then I was sliding around too much, so I put it back on. Then I was like 'Shit, I'm going no faster, so just take it off and spin.' In the end, we finished the race on quite a low setting. That worked OK, but it's the opposite way from Superbike and it was hard to get it into my head."

Reporters wanted to know whether it was the number of options which had confused Rea, or just the fact that the two series required diametrically opposed approaches. "For sure you have more options on a GP bike," Rea replied, "but I was confused because I knew which way I should go, but the lap time difference wasn't a lot, and I didn't understand is this actually better or is it making it worse? Instead of pinpointing my lines, I was in a rhythm, but to get closer to Bautista I was trying a lot of different things which meant my race was very inconsistent. Sometimes I would miss the apex, or run wide, but it's because I'm trying different things with my style to learn."

Rea went on to explain that the range of electronics strategies were virtually unlimited in MotoGP, and that it needed a lot of experience to understand what works best as the race progresses. "Electronically, in MotoGP, the possibilities are endless," Rea said. "With all the wet sessions, I haven't been able to fully understand exactly what happens when the tire really goes down. In the qualifying sessions we had in Misano and Aragon, you don't have time to put in 20 laps and try to understand what the traction control is doing, because you're fighting for a grid position. Brno was like learning to ride a bicycle again, so I don't classify that as a test. The one-and-a-half days we did here, that was when I practiced riding a MotoGP bike, but still for me, I've a lot to learn. "

"But the main differences are the possibilities of the electronics. In Superbikes I feel that with those electronics, the rider can make a much bigger difference. You can see for example on my bike, where our strategies aren't so sophisticated in Superbike I can still be quite competitive. But here the electronics is a huge part because we have such a strong engine that you need good electronics to be able to finish the race with still grip left on the tire. This was the hardest thing for me to understand, you can't teach this without doing race distance. For sure if I was to do this again, I would spend a lot more time on old tires and putting more and deeper thought into the electronics and understanding that."

Rea was asked if would like to have the MotoGP electronics on his Ten Kate Honda CBR1000RR World Superbike machine. Unsurprisingly, Rea's was enthusiastic about the idea. "Yes, I think I can learn a lot from how this is working," he said. "You know, HRC is a very smart company and the strategies they have inside the ECUs, it's cutting edge, it's something you can't just buy. We need to learn exactly how they're doing this. When you have an ECU or you buy an electronics system, you buy it in a box, but it's only as good as the little guy in the factory or the ECU programmers put inside, and that's where we really suffer in Superbikes. So we need a much more sophisticated system. On the plus side, what I think, and I've told my engineers, is I think the Superbike has a much easier drive off the corner. It feels like when I open the throttle on this bike not much happens directly, where on the Superbike I feel a lot more connection between the throttle and the rear tire. There's pluses and minuses, but for sure we can learn a lot from this paddock."

Was the difference in the throttle connection feeling down to the extra horsepower of the MotoGP bikes or the differences between the spec Pirelli tires used in World Superbikes and the MotoGP Bridgestones, Rea was asked. "For sure we have less horsepower in Superbikes, but we can use a lot more horsepower at less percentage of the throttle. I think that's a lot because we don't rely on the electronics so much, because you have to keep the tire here, so."
# Member of the CAWS Racing Team #


Stout Johnson

nice info C21! but maybe there are already systems that allow "packed" adjustments? well we don't know yet - so as for now, we should have mapping, TC, EB, AW all be adjusteable speperately I think
    -----------   WarStout Kawasaki Team   -----------

HornetMaX

I wonder how all these separate controls are laid out on the handlebars ...

In-game, it may make sense to do as suggested by Arvoss: one button to cycle through the different things we can change (TCS, AW, EB, Map) and one button to cycle through the different settings (e.g. TCS = 0, 1, 2, 3).

MaX.

C21

Don´t wonder  ;D

It will look like this:



;D
# Member of the CAWS Racing Team #


HornetMaX

So on the honda it looks like one "func" button and two buttons for "up/down". Fair enough for me. Maybe we can avoid the 3rd button as described above (1 func button, 1 "cycle" button), our pads are already full :)

MaX.