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December 05, 2019, 02:42:42 pm

Tips for crashing tracked

Started by pleclair, May 04, 2015, 09:26:35 pm

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pleclair

I was eager to get started and see what I can do with WRS/etc, so I set out to convert silverstone-international from ac, since I also know that track very well, so I could use it to train gpbikes.

Trying to load the .trp, which is probably linked to the .map file for the textures, the editor was crashing since the .map file is 815mb.  This happened to me in the kseditor (ac editor) before, and I tried the same fix I did to make the kseditor work with large map files.

The problem is tracked is 32bit app, and by default, it can only access 2gb of system ram, even on 64bit.  This was likely not enough to load the track so tracked crashed.. so that means, even with the patch, I might not be able to load nord's full scene.. as the map file will likely be much bigger then.

Anyway.. so if you stumble upon this issue, go there: http://ntcore.com/4gb_patch.php

download the patch and copy the .exe to tracked.exe directory and run it.  Select tracked.exe (or any other 32bit executable that gives you memory issues) and patch it.  The app will now be able to use 4gb of ram instead. 

So then, I was able to load silverstone-international in tracked...

Hope it helps someone :)

Hawk

Sounds like a very useful patch!  ;D 8)

Hopefully Piboso will take note and release a 64 bit version of TrackED... Why people are still programming for 32 bit staggers me these days!  ::)

Thanks pleclair. Appreciated mate!  ;)

Hawk.

HornetMaX

Quote from: Hawk UK on May 04, 2015, 11:35:21 pm
Why people are still programming for 32 bit staggers me these days!  ::)

Easy, because you still have a lot of people on 32bit OSs ... we still have people on XP ...

GPB is 32bit too, I'm not sure it leverages 64bit when you're on it.

MaX.

Hawk

May 05, 2015, 08:19:42 am #3 Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 08:22:35 am by Hawk UK
Quote from: HornetMaX on May 05, 2015, 07:30:49 am
Quote from: Hawk UK on May 04, 2015, 11:35:21 pm
Why people are still programming for 32 bit staggers me these days!  ::)

Easy, because you still have a lot of people on 32bit OSs ... we still have people on XP ...

GPB is 32bit too, I'm not sure it leverages 64bit when you're on it.

MaX.



About time they upgraded then, don't you think? :)

I mean it's been so long since 64 bit OS's and CPU's have been on the market now and, in my opinion, anyone who is really interested in simulation should be using true 64 bit systems to get the best out of them.

I installed my GPB install in my 64 bit  folder, though as you say Max, not sure whether it takes advantage of the extra power of the 64 bit architecture. Somehow I doubt it if it does cater for true 64bit systems. Personally I think there should be two versions available, true 64 bit and true 32 bit if you want to cater for them, as why bottle neck a simulations power by designing it around 32 bit architecture?? It just doesn't make sense to design a simulation that needs all the power and speed available to design it around a 32 bit system. Crazy in my opinion.  ::)

But sorry. I have no sympathy for 32 bit users these days..... Mac users too(but that's another story!)  :P

Hawk.
PS: Would be interesting to do a poll to find out how many GPB users are on 32 bit architecture systems.  ;)

HornetMaX

Well, GPB has an already limited user base, if on top you oblige people to be on 64bit, you lose some more potential customers.
It's going to improve over time, there're not plenty of reasons to be on 32bit OSs right now, so people will go 64. But it will take time.

Best shot would be Microsoft not publishing any new 32bit OS, of course :)

MaX.

pleclair

I don't recall a single game tho that was 64-bit only.  Usually, you add a x64 executable, not replace the 32bit one :)

Most recent simulators are using 64 bit, because its very easy to max out a 32 bit scene nowadays.  For most regular tracks, it is fine, but in some cases, there is just nothing you can do.

Something is striking tho.  The mesh+texture .kn5 of silverstone-international is 350mb.  The mesh+texture .map of the same track in WRS/GPB is 819MB.  So right there, you have a huge increase of memory used.  I'm wondering why it becomes so big.. more than twice the size.







pleclair

Oh that makes sense :)  I don't play AAA studios games :)  Most of my library consist of indie/early access games, I've ditched the big studios a few years ago.

There are few exceptions to the rule tho, as I lately got dirt:rally and I'm happy to see that codemasters finally listened to their fans for once, and done something right. 

But usually, I like to support small dev teams, that puts out original content.  Content that no AAA would ever attempt, because it would not net them enough cash.  But that's another topic :)

Most of the time tho, it does not go this way... a few days ago, after seeing a video of you on youtube with gpbikes, I noticed you were playing another bike game called RIDE.  I wasn't aware of it, and it looked fabulous.  Since its tax return time, I was able to get that game as the last one I will be getting now, and I'm realllllllllllly deceived.  Buggy as hell, no controller mappings, cannot play with wheel, and purely arcade.  Hitting a wall sometime just makes you bounce..  you can hit the rear brakes while leaning to max in a curve and nothing happens.. (all this on pro physic level btw)...

So yeah... I felt really bad purchasing that one.. Specially knowing its milestone.. they won't be fixing it up. they never fixed mxgp or any of their previous broken games...

When you have such problem with an indie title, you can rest assured that things will be taken in good hands.  When dealing with a AAA studio, if the money is flowing in, why spend money to fix things when it sells anyway.

For me, indie/early access gaming is the only way to go :P

HornetMaX

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
Oh that makes sense :)  I don't play AAA studios games :)

But 64bit only vs 32bit only vs 32+64bit is not really tied to be an indie or an AAA. As the request to have GPB on 64bit proves :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
a few days ago, after seeing a video of you on youtube with gpbikes, I noticed you were playing another bike game called RIDE.

It may have been me playing GPB, but not a video of me playing RIDE: I only got as far as trying the demo version for 30min before concluding "No thanks, not for me". And I'm sure I didn't put that on video :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
I wasn't aware of it, and it looked fabulous.  Since its tax return time, I was able to get that game as the last one I will be getting now, and I'm realllllllllllly deceived.

You should have read the comments about RIDE on this forum: most likely you'd have avoided the purchase :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
When you have such problem with an indie title, you can rest assured that things will be taken in good hands.  When dealing with a AAA studio, if the money is flowing in, why spend money to fix things when it sells anyway.

Not to say AAA will give you always plenty of support (most of the time they don't, but in some cases they still do a pretty decent job), but I wouldn't bet too much on the "(with an indie title) you can rest assured that things will be taken in good hands". If GPB had had 1/10th of the requested support, the game would now be a marvel. But Indie are typically small teams and they still have to eat and pay bills: the support goes only as far as they can afford (not criticizing too much here, it's just the way it is).

MaX.

HornetMaX

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 10:51:22 am
Something is striking tho.  The mesh+texture .kn5 of silverstone-international is 350mb.  The mesh+texture .map of the same track in WRS/GPB is 819MB.  So right there, you have a huge increase of memory used.  I'm wondering why it becomes so big.. more than twice the size.

Hmm .. maybe worth a post in the Bugs or Support section of the forum ?

MaX.

pleclair

May 05, 2015, 01:00:57 pm #10 Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 01:05:23 pm by pleclair
Quote from: HornetMaX on May 05, 2015, 11:50:37 am
Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
Oh that makes sense :)  I don't play AAA studios games :)

But 64bit only vs 32bit only vs 32+64bit is not really tied to be an indie or an AAA. As the request to have GPB on 64bit proves :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
a few days ago, after seeing a video of you on youtube with gpbikes, I noticed you were playing another bike game called RIDE.

It may have been me playing GPB, but not a video of me playing RIDE: I only got as far as trying the demo version for 30min before concluding "No thanks, not for me". And I'm sure I didn't put that on video :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
I wasn't aware of it, and it looked fabulous.  Since its tax return time, I was able to get that game as the last one I will be getting now, and I'm realllllllllllly deceived.

You should have read the comments about RIDE on this forum: most likely you'd have avoided the purchase :)

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 11:36:18 am
When you have such problem with an indie title, you can rest assured that things will be taken in good hands.  When dealing with a AAA studio, if the money is flowing in, why spend money to fix things when it sells anyway.

Not to say AAA will give you always plenty of support (most of the time they don't, but in some cases they still do a pretty decent job), but I wouldn't bet too much on the "(with an indie title) you can rest assured that things will be taken in good hands". If GPB had had 1/10th of the requested support, the game would now be a marvel. But Indie are typically small teams and they still have to eat and pay bills: the support goes only as far as they can afford (not criticizing too much here, it's just the way it is).

MaX.



Well, I dunno if it was you, but I believe it was, someone sent me a video on youtube (I mean linked a video here, in PM, I believe), and the name was girlracerstacey I think or something.  And that person also had many RIDE videos.  So I thought, if that person is so into gpbikes, then RIDE must be good too.  And after seeing the videos, I was sold out. 

I had my doubts when I saw Milestone, but as Codemasters redeemed themselves lately, I figured that milestone might have, and they seemed to be asking about what people wanted and about bugs in their forums, but after trying to get my wheel working, I noticed that many of the bugs people were reporting, were simply ignored.

As for 32bit vs 64bit, indie vs AAA... you're right, it has nothing to do... but I haven't seen a 64bit only indie game yet.  Usually they are supporting both.  That's what I meant when I said that makes sense for me, as all the titles that was in the list you shown me was all AAA stuff.

And as for support... well, it depends on the indie dev team size too.  GPB/WRS might not be the best example since it is made by one guy, and one guy can only do so much anyway.  But usually, they do try to please everybody.  At least, until ungrateful people start showing in and bash the game for no good reason, without giving any constructive comments.

But I can give you many many examples which what I said stand true.  Space Engineer, Medieval Engineer, rF2, AC, Next Car Game, BeamNG, The Forest, Project Zomboid, SNOW, 7 Days to Die, Interstellar Marines, Divinity, The Long Dark, and the list could go on...

These are all titles which have been listening to their community and building on their feedback a lot.  Development speed of Space Engineer, Medieval Engineer, The Forest, Project Zomboid is very good. 

On the other hand, I have sent a few requests for help to EA, Capcom and Blizzard in the past, and of those three, only blizzard listened.  EA and Capcom don't give a crap about you.  I bought SFIV when it came out.  I wanted to have a go at it last year, and I didn't had it no more on my computer.  It wasn't on steam back then, so I looked my emails, looking for the download link, since I bought it right from capcom, and it turns out the link had a 2 years life.  I couldn't access what I bought no more.  I emailed them about it, and there was nothing to be done about it.  They could not send me what I paid for, give me a steam key or anything...  I will never buy a capcom game again..  and tbh, only the SF series interest me...


HornetMaX

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 01:00:57 pm
Well, I dunno if it was you, but I believe it was, someone sent me a video on youtube (I mean linked a video here, in PM, I believe), and the name was girlracerstacey I think or something.

Damn now you exposed to anybody here that girlracerstacey is in fact me. Not.

Different person, different taste for bike sims, different gender (as far as I know) and, for god's sake, she's british and loves curry !

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 01:00:57 pm
But I can give you many many examples which what I said stand true.  Space Engineer, Medieval Engineer, rF2, AC, Next Car Game, BeamNG, The Forest, Project Zomboid, SNOW, 7 Days to Die, Interstellar Marines, Divinity, The Long Dark, and the list could go on...

These are all titles which have been listening to their community and building on their feedback a lot.  Development speed of Space Engineer, Medieval Engineer, The Forest, Project Zomboid is very good. 

No problem in believing you, but putting rF2 and AC in the Indie category is at least debatable. To me they are both AAA, even if they may (or may not) be independent from the big guns in the game arena.

MaX.

pleclair

 :-[

Sorry I didn't meant to :)  Lol, I dunno who then, I would have to look at my pms, but anyway, I thought it was you who sent me that video.   

Lol, curry :)  This stinks!

Well, ISI and Kunos are both indie in technical terms.  Not that long ago, ISI had rFactor 1, and had very little licensed tracks and cars, and made their own fictive things.  They relied on modding to get the brand name cars and tracks. 

Kunos was about the same a few years ago with netkar pro.  The fact that sim racing picked up popularity, and the huge success of rf1 and simbin games have helped a lot.  They were able to build some wealth and for their next respective product, they were able to license stuff. 

They are by no mean a AAA studio in term of size, wealth, and customer support :)  But compared to beamng, wrs, gpb, xmotor racing, one could consider them to be.  They are not tied to a publisher either and they do as they please and are not restricted in any way, except by money and time.

You also have to remember that both of these studios are closely tied with some real life racing teams, working with them.  ISI have rfactor pro, which I heard, many f1 drivers use to train when off track, and also heard that kunos have some pro grade sim for race teams as well.  So this helps making money outside selling to individual user.

SimBin have the raceroom cafe at the nordschleife track. 

But all these were rather small a few years ago. 

And reiza is coming up fast too... their sims are pretty darn awesome.  And both simbin and reiza started as rfactor mod teams. 

:)  AAA don't make simulators.  Still too niche for them, but I wouldnt be surprised to see them try in the near future.  It's certainly nice to see codemasters go back to their roots with dirt: rally.  I highly suggest you check it out if you haven't already.  It is highly promising.  They went early access with this one, to gather feedback as they build it.  So far, people are mostly very very happy.  With a few kids saying this is too hard, but its good :P  This is not a full blown simulator, as the visuals are still a bit too high to leave that much room to simulate everything, but still, its a lot more closer to simulation than arcade.. and far from the simcade dirt 3.  As a matter of fact tho, the visuals are a bit step down from dirt 3.  They also look a lot more realistic, with good saturation level (not too saturated)..

We are so off topic :P

But a good discussion nevertheless :)




pleclair

May 05, 2015, 02:28:27 pm #13 Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 02:30:28 pm by pleclair
At this point tho, it might be worth pointing this out.

As you can see, all these successful simulators from ISI, Kunos, SimBin and Reiza have one thing in common.  Well for one, ISI, SimBin and Reiza all use the gmotor engine.  And kunos have their own.  But what is common to all of them, is how open the platform is.  You can mod everything easily, and you have everything you need to know right from the start.  The tools works good and don't crash very often too.  You can even mod the whole UI for all these games.

BeamNG also follows in the same footsteps.  They are coming off very nicely, and I expect them to be amongst the top in a few years from now.  Their platform is the most open of them all.  You can do just about anything with it.  Simulate a copter?  No problem.  A boat?  No problem..  A caterpillar, no problem :)  You can do just about anything, and again, the modding community is very strong.

When I visited x motor racing forums and this one here, both games are running for quite some years already, and the modding support is not what it should be.  One reason... the platform is too closed.  As it is, I cannot work on anything for this game, since I don't even know how to setup the shaders, beside doing some simple bump/spec mapping, which really, is no good for terrain and track surface.  I need to know how to do diffuse+detail to make it look good.  This shouldn't require me searching for days on end on the matter.  It should be either selectable in an editor, or in a max plugin, or at least, the wiki should contain every possible definition a shader can have.  Cause if the wiki list everything possibility, which is bump, spec, reflections... I cannot think that Piboso built his track using only this.  And this is the reason why only piboso is able to make really good looking tracks so far.

I'm still new here, and this game seems to have quite a few years already of existence.. this shouldn't be this way.  Since piboso can't put out the much needed content by himself for now, since he haves so much to do in other fields, by letting full access to shaders, his models, his textures, physics (you can reuse anything from ISI and Kunos's sim when working on tracks for their own respective sims.. so if you want the grass of limerock park for your track, you are free to take it, as long as the track is for rfactor, and that makes sense)... modding won't ever be able to do some proper content for the game.  I know a few mod tracks looks better than some others, but I dont think I can say I have seen anything that looks anywhere near the default piboso's tracks, or anything from the other sims.

The mugello track for gpb is probably the best, since it comes from AC... but it still looks far from what it looks in AC and could look in here if we knew how to work properly.

As it is now, I have a lot of free time.  Since I joined the forum, I could have pumped out probably two WRS conversions, if not more, from AC... but I can't... 

I'm gonna have a lot of time for maybe another month or two.. after I might not... so... that's sad...


HornetMaX

Content and visuals are far from being the #1 problem of GPB. I wish they were, because it would mean the other issues are behind us. But that's not the case.

Quote from: pleclair on May 05, 2015, 02:28:27 pm
I know a few mod tracks looks better than some others, but I dont think I can say I have seen anything that looks anywhere near the default piboso's tracks

Are you sure ? Because Victoria (default for GPB and WRS) is not that nice to look at. IMO there're plenty of mod tracks which look better, way better.

MaX.