Tyre overheat (?) after crash.

[Napalm Nick]

Not sure this has been submitted as a "bug" even though it has been discussed elsewhere on  the forum.

But after tonight's race and the discussions there, I said I would submit it here:
Edited text based on thread discussion
Problem:
After a crash the probability of further crashes increases greatly.

Effect:
Many ruined/not fun races.

Possible Cause:
It seems to be tyre temperature related - during the crash/slide tyre temp increases too much causing further slides/crashes to compound the problem. But there may also be another reason.Tyre returning to a 'normal' temperature is too slow.
A burn-out proves this as a few seconds burn-out will make tyre have 0 grip for ages afterwards

Possible Fix:
Reset tyre temperature to optimum or tyre-warmer temperature when bike is reset to track / Don't allow tyres to overheat during crash / Don't crash(! not possible until physics improved) / Other reason Change tyres so return to 'normal' temperature is faster

Temporary notice to riders:
After a crash, ride slower until temperatures come down it seems to help

Thank you. As always we are happy to assist with any testing that might be needed, to assist this, or any, fix.

[Blackheart]

Not sure this has been submitted as a "bug" even though it has been discussed elsewhere on  the forum.

But after tonight's race and the discussions there, I said I would submit it here:

Problem:
After a crash the probability of further crashes increases greatly.

Effect:
Many ruined/not fun races.

Possible Cause:
It seems to be tyre temperature related - during the crash/slide tyre temp increases too much causing further slides/crashes to compound the problem. But there may also be another reason.

Possible Fix:
Reset tyre temperature to optimum or tyre-warmer temperature when bike is reset to track / Don't allow tyres to overheat during crash / Don't crash(! not possible until physics improved) / Other reason

Temporary notice to riders:
After a crash, ride slower until temperatures come down it seems to help

Thank you. As always we are happy to assist with any testing that might be needed, to assist this, or any, fix.

Piboso I hope you read this... 

[HornetMaX]

Which bikes were you using ? GP800 ?

It's already known but in my experience, it happens mostly (if not only) with mod bikes (I recall having told oDi about it a few times). Don't know why though.

MaX.

[Hawk]

Which bikes were you using ? GP800 ?

It's already known but in my experience, it happens mostly (if not only) with mod bikes (I recall having told oDi about it a few times). Don't know why though.

MaX.

It was a race with only the default marusama RC 990 on server/track. 

Hawk

[HornetMaX]

Ouch then.

MaX.

[Napalm Nick]

And the track was Victoria. 

[BOBR6 84]

Probably related to the same bug (has to be a bug  ) where after a burnout you have no chance of moving forward.. Tyre spins like its on ice..

[h106frp]

Not sure this has been submitted as a "bug" even though it has been discussed elsewhere on  the forum.

But after tonight's race and the discussions there, I said I would submit it here:

Problem:
After a crash the probability of further crashes increases greatly.

Effect:
Many ruined/not fun races.

Possible Cause:
It seems to be tyre temperature related - during the crash/slide tyre temp increases too much causing further slides/crashes to compound the problem. But there may also be another reason.

Possible Fix:
Reset tyre temperature to optimum or tyre-warmer temperature when bike is reset to track / Don't allow tyres to overheat during crash / Don't crash(! not possible until physics improved) / Other reason

Temporary notice to riders:
After a crash, ride slower until temperatures come down it seems to help

Thank you. As always we are happy to assist with any testing that might be needed, to assist this, or any, fix.

I wonder if the tyre temp model is very simple and the localized temperature increase is applied to the whole tyre rather than averaged into the whole mass.

[CapeDoctor]

Probably related to the same bug (has to be a bug  ) where after a burnout you have no chance of moving forward.. Tyre spins like its on ice..

i'm happy to hear this is a general issue, and not some problem on my side - i was considering making a bug report for this, when i could find no problems with my controller, but the bike simply won't ride after a burnout. hope it can be addressed 

[HornetMaX]

I wonder if the tyre temp model is very simple and the localized temperature increase is applied to the whole tyre rather than averaged into the whole mass.

If we had the tyre temp in the telemetry (*) I could probably have a look.
From the outside, the model seems to cover the main areas (3 tyre zones left/middle/right, with their own temp, temp evolution dictated by environment and how you use the tyre).
If I recall correctly, the dependency between the tyre "grip" and the tyre temperature (delta with respect the optimal temperature) is just linear: maybe that's a bit too simple and gives silly values when the tyre is extremely cold or extremely hot (a simple non-linear function could fix that, or even cap the linear dependency to some min and max values).

Probably related to the same bug (has to be a bug  ) where after a burnout you have no chance of moving forward.. Tyre spins like its on ice..

Could be explained by what I said above. But once you're on a slippy tyre, the time it takes to go back to normal looks OK or is it way off ?

MaX.

(*)
Just another example of annoying omission requested like 2 years ago, 5min development job, and ignored up to now.
During tests, bikes can definitely have temp sensors for tyres ... so if the argument "the community wants it" is not enough, the "make it as close to reality as possible" could kick in.
I wouldn't mind if the tyre temp was not available during quali and races. BTW, I think the tyre temp is available (on screen) when physics debug is on.

[BOBR6 84]

Probably related to the same bug (has to be a bug  ) where after a burnout you have no chance of moving forward.. Tyre spins like its on ice..

Could be explained by what I said above. But once you're on a slippy tyre, the time it takes to go back to normal looks OK or is it way off ?

MaX.

No idea.. to me, how the tyre's react to overheating in GPB is a bit too extreme and sudden.. be nice if we could feel the tyres gradually loosing grip.. so its difficult to say how long it takes for the temp's to come down because the tyre's shouldn't really get to the point of 0 grip as it does in GPB.

[PeterV]

1 simple donut overheats the tyre so much that it will prevent you from leaving.
It can take a very longtime before the tyre cools down.
Most of the times the tyre keeps spinning as well (possible through the no grip issue)

https://youtube.be/v/thUoIkG4zVA

[Napalm Nick]

Hmm I cant see that video it is "Private". Dread to think what it might be but hoping it explains our problem well 

[PeterV]

Hmm I cant see that video it is "Private". Dread to think what it might be but hoping it explains our problem well 

mhh.. press publish Obi Wan says too pete....I did mhhhh

[Napalm Nick]

Hey Peter that video shows the problem PERFECTLY - glad you got the temperature in too.
Nice job! Thanks.