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August 13, 2020, 03:05:35 PM

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GP Bikes beta18c available! :)


The State of Modern MotoGP, Past and Future.....

Started by Hawk, July 18, 2019, 12:00:46 PM

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Myst1cPrun3

There's also a reason why it nearly financially killed grand Prix racing  :o

Hawk

Quote from: Myst1cPrun3 on June 10, 2020, 03:54:05 PMThere's also a reason why it nearly financially killed grand Prix racing  :o

But they didn't, did they..... In fact they came back stronger when the factories started to sell their engines alone to privateer teams.
The time your talking about was just a period of bad management by the governing bodies of the world championships series..... In fact it was Kenney Roberts who helped a great deal in getting the changes through to right the wrongs at the time and get the 500's back in business again.

So no. It wasn't 2 strokes that nearly financially killed GP racing at all, it was just bad management by the governing bodies and lack of thought from the factories at the time towards privateer teams.

Myst1cPrun3

Up until 2002 when the MotoGP era started grids were shrinking and costs skyrocketing.

Granted the early 90s was worse, and they did use factory teams to sell engines and bikes to privateers, but it was very much a temporary plaster rather than a permanent operation, which is what was needed.

And what it got in the switch to 4 strokes.

I'm not saying there was no external factors such as management, sponsorships and manufacturer decisions etc, but overall the 2 stroke engines and motorcycles were too expensive to keep developing.

And there road application was limited even then, with 750s and 1000 twins taking over, so all that rnd money wasn't being returned to the manufacturers.



I do however wonder what 2 strokes would be like with todays rules, and what MotoGP would be like if we stuck to 2t

Granted we have the suter, but that's very much a compromise, (I imagine a perfect bike for you hawk) with no aids but modern fueling etc, but I don't believe it to be where MotoGP would have been.

Huh
That could be an idea for a GP Bikes mod....  ;)

I'll look into that



Hawk

Quote from: Myst1cPrun3 on June 11, 2020, 12:26:30 AMUp until 2002 when the MotoGP era started grids were shrinking and costs skyrocketing.

Granted the early 90s was worse, and they did use factory teams to sell engines and bikes to privateers, but it was very much a temporary plaster rather than a permanent operation, which is what was needed.

And what it got in the switch to 4 strokes.

I'm not saying there was no external factors such as management, sponsorships and manufacturer decisions etc, but overall the 2 stroke engines and motorcycles were too expensive to keep developing.

And there road application was limited even then, with 750s and 1000 twins taking over, so all that rnd money wasn't being returned to the manufacturers.



I do however wonder what 2 strokes would be like with todays rules, and what MotoGP would be like if we stuck to 2t

Granted we have the suter, but that's very much a compromise, (I imagine a perfect bike for you hawk) with no aids but modern fueling etc, but I don't believe it to be where MotoGP would have been.

Huh
That could be an idea for a GP Bikes mod....  ;)

I'll look into that




Well in theory, 2-strokes should be a lot cheaper to produce than 4-strokes(a lot less parts to design and build). ;)

Besides, at the time(you probably won't remember this cause your too young), the public roads were full of 2-stroke bikes being ridden for everyday use by people..... Right from 50cc for the school leavers, right up to 750cc bikes.
It was the 4-strokes that were few and far between; they were considered just a touring bike ridden by the old generations who only brought them out on hot sunny days for road trips. And the funny thing is it's still the same today except all the 2-strokes have disappeared, we hardly see any bikers on the roads these days except for race days and the odd person on a sunny day posing around...... Virtually banning 2-strokes from the bike market killed the bike market in the UK.... People started to by-pass getting a bike and went to getting cars instead. The only bikers left(if you can really call them bikers anymore? More like Sunday riders out on sunny days. Lol!),they only buy bikes as a type of extra mode of transport that they only use in summer and nice days out for posing and road trips..... It's all changed for the worse.... Just a totally different attitude and era, I'm afraid..... Very sad state of affairs for the bike market. :(  :(

As for the MOD idea: That would be great mate..... Love to see it.... Get on it mate, make it a beast!! ;D  ;D  8)

Myst1cPrun3

I will say the reduction of 2t on the road did change the market somewhat, but I wouldn't say it killed the market.

Stalled it maybe as manufacturers alter rnd and tech to accommodate.

In-fact in the past few years (5-10) the amount of license passes and bike sales has risen showing a bright future for bikes. I don't know how many people can be classed as bikers but still. I would have had one if I was allowed.  ;D

The future is Even more bright looking at it, now bikes are exempt from the 'electronic vehicle requirement' that's being introduced.



There is also rumour of the 600cc SSP market being replaced with 750cc bikes to combat the catalytic converter power saps which I find interesting, and I hope it happens. Love 750s


And the mod:

Can't promise it'll be any good, or done any time soon, but I'll give it a go. I'll aim for a release with GP Bikes version one.  ;)

Vini

lol come on. Today's 4t MotoGP bikes are much more expensive than the 500s.

Manu

What killed 2T is that there was no impact on sales of two-stroke bikes while four-stroke dominated the streets.
It's Easier to Fool People Than It Is to Convince Them That They Have Been Fooled.

Hawk

Quote from: Manu on June 11, 2020, 04:15:41 PMWhat killed 2T is that there was no impact on sales of two-stroke bikes while four-stroke dominated the streets.

Not so in the UK Manu.....

I'd say it was simply to do with the new laws the UK gov brought in at the time..... I personally suspect it being an economic plot to get people to buy 4t's instead of 2t's.... But the general reaction at the time was to not buy a bike at all and buy a car instead. That's what a cock-up the UK Gov made of the transition from 2t to 4t bikes in the UK market..... It would be different in other countries of course. ;)